Avtm Loan

[Marshall]

I believe ATVM is simply a loan guarantee, not a loan itself. Any money going out would be provided by a bank, and gov't money would only be involved if Elio failed to pay back the loan. Please correct me if I'm wrong.


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Graft takes many forms. Direct or indirect, the results are the same. Student loans are great example.

Theoretically, the loans are guaranteed and the banks make the loans. But wide spread default, just makes the Government Funding indirect as they pay the bank with interest rather than making the loan themselves.

The previous failures of loan guarantees given by the ATVM may have worked in that manner and why it was under scrutiny.

But once again, real life politics intrudes in real world startups such as Elio Motors. But finding a viable startup such as Elio may very well be the grease that pushes their loan through the process which is biased toward the Electric political agenda, even though it is an ICE vehicle.

EDIT - I later found that the Loans are DIRECT and not a guarantee program.

 

[Marshall]

Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing (ATVM) Loan Program is a $25 billion direct loan program funded by Congress in fall 2008 to provide debt capital to the U.S. automotive industry for the purpose of funding projects that help vehicles manufactured in the U.S. meet higher mileage requirements and lessen U.S. dependence on foreign oil.

This should answer the question posed.

 

[Rob Croson]

Speaking of semantics, why wouldn't the 25 E series vehicles satisfy proof of concept? Other than not being built in Shreveport, isn't it the same "concept"? Or is the production facility part of the concept? One could argue that the production facility is already proven.

The 25 E-Series vehicles will not all be complete vehicles. they have stated that the individuals vehicles iwll be built only to the extent required to perform the tests designated for that vehicle. If a particular part, such as, say, the engine, will not be needed for testing for that vehicle, it will not be installed. A vehicle that is intended for testing of body panel fit and finish, interior assembly, door/hatch/hood wear-and-tear, accessibility and ease of entry/exit, etc., won't get an engine, and maybe not even a full front end/suspension.

 

[Johnny Acree]

This is the way I look at the ATVM loan.
It's like putting the cart before the horse.
The ATVM can only be used the buy the cart (tooling) not to buy the horse (product).
Their is no reason to borrow money to buy a cart if you don't have a horse.
I think as soon as EM has a horse the ATVM will be approved because the ATVM money can only be used for tooling for the factory.

 

[Elio Amazed]

This is the way I look at the ATVM loan.
It's like putting the cart before the horse.
The ATVM can only be used the buy the cart (tooling) not to buy the horse (product).
Their is no reason to borrow money to buy a cart if you don't have a horse.
I think as soon as EM has a horse the ATVM will be approved because the ATVM money can only be used for tooling for the factory.

And can be used for the parts that will become the first few thousand horses?
And insurance... And the first couple of months payroll... etc?

 

[Johnny Acree]

This is the line from Wiki I was remembering

apply the loans to future investments "reasonably related to the reequipping, expanding, or establishing a manufacturing facility in the U.S

 

[Elio Amazed]

This is the line from Wiki I was remembering

apply the loans to future investments "reasonably related to the reequipping, expanding, or establishing a manufacturing facility in the U.S

Is it possible that the language could be interpreted to mean establishing a working manufacturing facility?
To be a working facility, it needs a work force, security, insurance, etc, etc.
To be a true working facility, It also needs Elio parts.

I'm thinking that 183M is excessive if used only for tooling a plant that EM says already has most of the required machinery.

 

[3wheelin]

Is it possible that the language could be interpreted to mean establishing a working manufacturing facility?
To be a working facility, it needs a work force, security, insurance, etc, etc.
To be a true working facility, It also needs Elio parts.

I'm thinking that 183M is excessive if used only for tooling a plant that EM says already has most of the required machinery.

The scary version is the 183M ATVM loan IF approved MAY not even be enough for anything but just to get them started and may operate at a loss! But hey, it's still better than nothing! It's purely assumption only on my part and not real detective work!

 

[Marshall]

This is the line from Wiki I was remembering

apply the loans to future investments "reasonably related to the reequipping, expanding, or establishing a manufacturing facility in the U.S

LIKE!

 

[wizard of ahs]

The scary version is the 183M ATVM loan IF approved MAY not even be enough for anything but just to get them started and may operate at a loss!But hey, it's still better than nothing! It's purely assumption only on my part and not real detective work!

I'm sure they WILL operate at a loss............in the beginning !!

I know from experience..........when starting a business......you MUST be prepared to operate at a loss for the first 5 years !!

If not, don't start it