Better Than An Electric By Far

[johnsnownw]

Not sure what it would take to get a Volt to run through its battery in less than half its EPA estimated range...sustained 80 mph with a considerable headwind?

We pay $0.08 most of the year, and the national average is $0.12...even Hawaii, which I believe has the highest rates, pays $0.25 for their TOU rate.

EVs are most efficient when being used as an urban commuter, something the Elio is also advertised as and will get considerably less than 84 mpg doing so.

If you prefer to drive a hyper-efficient ICE vehicle over a BEV that's totally respectable, both reduce your carbon footprint. Spreading EV FUD is unnecessary, however.

 

[Marshall]

Not sure what it would take to get a Volt to run through its battery in less than half its EPA estimated range...sustained 80 mph with a considerable headwind?

We pay $0.08 most of the year, and the national average is $0.12...even Hawaii, which I believe has the highest rates, pays $0.25 for their TOU rate.

EVs are most efficient when being used as an urban commuter, something the Elio is also advertised as and will get considerably less than 84 mpg doing so.

If you prefer to drive a hyper-efficient ICE vehicle over a BEV that's totally respectable, both reduce your carbon footprint. Spreading EV FUD is unnecessary, however.

Most people don't consider the economics of their vehicle until it becomes a problem and then it's too late. Point out inaccuracies in any report, whether positive or negative is simply a service.

Volts may be environmentally friendly, but they're not economically friendly at this time. Perhaps in the future they will be. Of course, you can easily point out worse vehicles if you're just looking for better rather than good.

 

[johnsnownw]

Most people don't consider the economics of their vehicle until it becomes a problem and then it's too late. Point out inaccuracies in any report, whether positive or negative is simply a service.

Volts may be environmentally friendly, but they're not economically friendly at this time. Perhaps in the future they will be. Of course, you can easily point out worse vehicles if you're just looking for better rather than good.

Quite true. If your main focus is frugality a $6800 Elio, and cheap gas, will most likely beat the TCO of new unincentivized EVs for some time.

 

[wizard of ahs]

Most people don't consider the economics of their vehicle until it becomes a problem and then it's too late. Point out inaccuracies in any report, whether positive or negative is simply a service.

Volts may be environmentally friendly, but they're not economically friendly at this time. Perhaps in the future they will be. Of course, you can easily point out worse vehicles if you're just looking for better rather than good.

A "gently" used one CAN be economical

 

[WilliamH]

Quite true. If your main focus is frugality a $6800 Elio, and cheap gas, will most likely beat the TCO of new unincentivized EVs for some time.

I wouldn't stake my life on how long the incentive program will last.
And I sure as heck wouldn't do long term budgeting based on it.

 

[Rickb]

Quite true. If your main focus is frugality a $6800 Elio, and cheap gas, will most likely beat the TCO of new unincentivized EVs for some time.

That doesn't hold true when comparing Elio's TCO to an affordable three wheeler EV TCO like the $11,900 SRK, $15K Solo, or $10K Toyota i-Road.

 

[Rickb]

I wouldn't stake my life on how long the incentive program will last.
And I sure as heck wouldn't do long term budgeting based on it.

My understanding is that the incentive program was enacted as an incentive to encourage sales and ultimately get a million EV's on the road in support of alternative vehicle options until EVs became more affordable to the masses.......not you, but the millions that will find EV's workable for their everyday driving needs. It seems EV's are becoming more affordable and the incentive programs will end. 300,000 + Tesla Model 3 reservations and God only knows the total number of SRK reservations. Those numbers alone may indicate that EV's are the future of transportation. My guess is that in the very near future roadways will be lined with EV's and Elio's and finally taking up space in my garage. (No URL, only BS)

 

[WilliamH]

My understanding is that the incentive program was enacted as an incentive to encourage sales and ultimately get a million EV's on the road in support of alternative vehicle options until EVs became more affordable to the masses.......not you, but the millions that will find EV's workable for their everyday driving needs. It seems EV's are becoming more affordable and the incentive programs will end. 300,000 + Tesla Model 3 reservations and God only knows the total number of SRK reservations. Those numbers alone may indicate that EV's are the future of transportation. My guess is that in the very near future roadways will be lined with EV's and Elio's and finally taking up space in my garage. (No URL, only BS)

When I commented on the incentive program it was with the phase out in mind.
And the language is not real clear on what the phase out includes.
For example, are Chevy, Cadillac, and Buick all lumped together under GM or are the taken individually.
In any case, here is some of the source.......

---> https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/taxevb.shtml <---
"The credit begins to phase out for vehicles at the beginning of the second calendar quarter after the manufacturer has sold 200,000 eligible plug-in electric vehicles (i.e., plug-in hybrids and EVs) in the United States as counted from January 1, 2010. IRS will announce when a manufacturer exceeds this production figure and will announce the subsequent phase out schedule."

 

[Sethodine]

"Gently used" (leased/pre-owned) EVs are selling for the same price as equivalent ICE cars now, so if you ignore the new-car sticker price and look at what is actually on the market, there are many savings and advantages to EVs.

I'm not so much a fan of plug-in hybrids though. To me, it seems you are taking the worst aspects of a BEV and a ICE and bundling them together on a single car. Even worse electric range than a BEV, and you still have all of the ICE maintenance like oil, exhaust systems, etc. Too much compromise for too little benefit, in my mind. But again, buying pre-owned could certainly make it more economical than buying a pre-owned ICE. It all depends on the purchase price, really.

 

[johnsnownw]

When I commented on the incentive program it was with the phase out in mind.
And the language is not real clear on what the phase out includes.
For example, are Chevy, Cadillac, and Buick all lumped together under GM or are the taken individually.
In any case, here is some of the source.......

---> https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/taxevb.shtml <---
"The credit begins to phase out for vehicles at the beginning of the second calendar quarter after the manufacturer has sold 200,000 eligible plug-in electric vehicles (i.e., plug-in hybrids and EVs) in the United States as counted from January 1, 2010. IRS will announce when a manufacturer exceeds this production figure and will announce the subsequent phase out schedule."

GM is considered the manufacturer of several different "brands," all brands fall under the umbrella of GM. Therefore, GM will be allotted 200k credits, just as Tesla, before they begin to expire.