Hot Off The Press: Intent To Manufacture Engines Signed With Linamar

[AriLea]

The Thunderbird? In the 50's thru the 70's, one of the big mis-matches of all time was the European idea of a sportscar vs the USA-ien concept of it (also vs the Italian vs the French). I think primarily it had to do with the local racing forms. A sports car was supposed to be the street version of whatever is actually racing. Comparably speaking, US: Power and top speed, Euro: Handling, Grip and Nimbleness.(with exceptions)

In Italy they made them race ready (luxury added), but only raced a cleaver clone. (more humor here than fact) And the French? Sooo much persona over function it's hard to separate fact from fiction. In many ways the German and English stayed more concise to ideals.(IMHO)

But then over time, quite often, the sportscar became just the persona of racing imagery. Possibly the best example of that, IMHO, the Camero.
I don't think that movie qualifies as a real race. You know THAT movie, smokey!
There is very little in the consumer product that matches any racing counterpart. OK, OK some of the drivetrain, and of course the shell.

So I say, if you only require persona, the Thunderbird is a sportscar. If that must have a racers pedigree, then probably not.
However it does belong to a category very native to N.American culture (inclusive!: Canada & Mexico) which Sportscars automatically belong to, the Cruiser. I don't think there is a more iconic persona than Saturday night cruising around in a 70's convertible Thunderbird! Pink? All the better.

 

[Elio Amazed]

The Thunderbird? In the 50's thru the 70's, one of the big mis-matches of all time was the European idea of a sportscar vs the USA-ien concept of it (also vs the Italian vs the French). I think primarily it had to do with the local racing forms. A sports car was supposed to be the street version of whatever is actually racing. Comparably speaking, US: Power and top speed, Euro: Handling, Grip and Nimbleness.(with exceptions)

In Italy they made them race ready (luxury added), but only raced a cleaver clone. (more humor here than fact) And the French? Sooo much persona over function it's hard to separate fact from fiction. In many ways the German and English stayed more concise to ideals.(IMHO)

But then over time, quite often, the sportscar became just the persona of racing imagery. Possibly the best example of that, IMHO, the Camero.
I don't think that movie qualifies as a real race. You know THAT movie, smokey!
There is very little in the consumer product that matches any racing counterpart. OK, OK some of the drivetrain, and of course the shell.

So I say, if you only require persona, the Thunderbird is a sportscar. If that must have a racers pedigree, then probably not.
However it does belong to a category very native to N.American culture (inclusive!: Canada & Mexico) which Sportscars automatically belong to, the Cruiser. I don't think there is a more iconic persona than Saturday night cruising around in a 70's convertible Thunderbird! Pink? All the better.

Nicely said.
I had a green '68 2-door with all leather, power everything and the biggest stock engine they put in them.

 

[Muzhik]

Are you talking about the same thing the rest of us were?

Looking back, apparently not. Proof that I should not post after my bedtime. I was referring to the photo of the auto in post #103.

 

[TCBronson]

What a lot of people get confused on with Sports cars is they have been brainwashed by the media on cars that came out and were tagged "Sports type car". Looks like a sports car, but has the true inner child of an econo box.
The Toyota Celica was the one that started it.
Now when people see any car that "looks" like a sports car, in their minds, it is a sports car.

There are "Sports Cars" and there are "Sporty Cars". True Sports cars usually cost a lot more than a Sporty Car, in my opinion.

 

[Ekh]

Fundamentally, from about 1960 on, American cars pushed power, and European cars emphasized agility. American cars back in the day had absolutely lousy soft suspensions, terrible cornering, and fade-prone brakes. They wallowed. European cars, by contrast, had less power (for the most part), but were nimble, cornered on rails, (0.9, right?) and stopped smoothly and promptly. They were fun to drive on all sorts of roads, and, though less massive, in my book a whole lot safer than the behemoth "muscle cars" of the era. I have always believed that it's safer to drive out of trouble than to drive a tank.

The cars in my life I'd consider true sports cars were a Porsche 911S, a Marcos GT, a Mazda RX7, and a MR2 Turbo (Definitely a sports car, that one). I don't count the Fiat 850 because it was too underpowered to live, nor the Opel Kadet because it was a POS from the git-go. Except for my first car (a 1960 Ford Falcon), a 1962 Chevy Nova, a $250 Rambler (bought to tide me over when the Porsche ate its second tranny), and a 1983 Buick Skylark with a hotted-up engine, all the others have been European or Japanese. (The 1975 or so Fiesta was build in Germany and was a great small car)

Why? Overall quality of manufacturing, agility, braking, and good power (mostly) were what I valued. I remain unconvinced that Detroit will EVER build a car I like. There must be exceptions -- but I see no point in trying them one after another to prove myself wrong!

Elio looks as if it will be EXACTLY the kind of car I love, small, nimble, fun to drive, inexpensive -- and it won't be built in or by Detroit. Give me the turbo version and I'm in hog heaven.

 

[TCBronson]

Fundamentally, from about 1960 on, American cars pushed power, and European cars emphasized agility. American cars back in the day had absolutely lousy soft suspensions, terrible cornering, and fade-prone brakes. They wallowed. European cars, by contrast, had less power (for the most part), but were nimble, cornered on rails, (0.9, right?) and stopped smoothly and promptly. They were fun to drive on all sorts of roads, and, though less massive, in my book a whole lot safer than the behemoth "muscle cars" of the era. I have always believed that it's safer to drive out of trouble than to drive a tank.

The cars in my life I'd consider true sports cars were a Porsche 911S, a Marcos GT, a Mazda RX7, and a MR2 Turbo (Definitely a sports car, that one). I don't count the Fiat 850 because it was too underpowered to live, nor the Opel Kadet because it was a POS from the git-go. Except for my first car, a 1960 Ford Falcon, a 1962 Chevy Nova, a $250 Rambler (bought to tide me over when the Porsche ate its second tranny), and a 1983 Buick Skylark with a hotted-up engine, all the others have been European or Japanese. (The 1975 or so Fiesta was build in Germany and was a great small car)

Why? Overall quality of manufacturing, agility, braking, and good power (mostly) were what I valued. I remain unconvinced that Detroit will EVER build a car I like. There must be exceptions -- but I see no point in trying them one after another to prove myself wrong!

Elio looks as if it will be EXACTLY the kind of car I love, small, nimble, fun to drive, inexpensive -- and it won't be built in or by Detroit. Give me the turbo version and I'm in hog heaven.

Is the Corvette a "Sports Car" in your opinion?

 

[Ekh]

Is the Corvette a "Sports Car" in your opinion?

Some years and models, yes, others not -- but I haven't drive very many of them and have only been a passenger in them a handful of times. It is true that you can trick out Vettes (or many american cars) to make them "sportier" but they don't have the died-in-the-wool feel of being utterly under the driver's control -- and up to the driver to make the most of it.

 

[Coss]

I think the one car that I've had that was just memorable was my 74 Lotus Europa.
1600 Twin-Cam JPS (JPS- Johnny Player Special), only car that would redline in 5th gear; fantastic in the dry, stay in the garage when it was wet because all of the control you had, goes away in the wet. Hard as hell to get in and out of; no luggage room, but who cares, it was so much fun to drive.

 

[BiloxiGeek]

I'd say my 1970 Datsun Roadster 1600 (Fairlady) would definitely land in the sports car category. Almost no practical value but it was a blast to drive.

Wish I still had it.

 

[AriLea]

No practical value but a blast to drive? Yup, I hear yah! I can attest to the power. No extensive history to relate on handling. (image repost)
Ditto, wish I still had it..