Efficient Vehicle Tax

[CheeseheadEarl]

Weather and weight do most of the highway damage. Weather we can't control. Paying based on GVW x miles traveled would be the best route, IMO.

At 1800? GVW an elio would come out pretty well too.

 

[UCF'73]

SC has one of the lowest gas tax in the nation and also the worst roads. No surprise. Strangely, it also has one of the highest annual property taxes on vehicles. If you drive a $30k car, you'll pay over $1k a year to the state DMV. That's one reason we drive them til the wheels fall off. Unfortunately, this annual tax money is not earmarked to fix roads and bridges.

 

[#491]

For those of you who have spent much time overseas you will probably agree with me that the US is the most ass backwards country in regards to fuel economy mostly due the topic being discussed, gas taxes. Small 3 (and even 2) cylinder vehicles are all over the world and 60+ MPG is readily available in most parts of the world EXCEPT the US. Why? Taxes! Simple. Fuel choices are also better including regular gas (hardly used overseas), diesel (primary choice), propane and ethanol.

What incentive does the US and each state have in promoting fuel efficient vehicles? None! Simple again. I don't know exact numbers but I hear that close to 50% of the price you pay for gas is tax. Let’s say that’s roughly $1.50 per gallon and the "average" car gets 20 MPG. at 12k miles per year that's $900 a year in gas tax alone. Why would ANY local, state, or federal government want to give up that revenue. Like I said, no incentive.

The only way government will fully embrace highly efficient hybrid, electric, and "Elio" type vehicles is to fully abolish the gas tax and switch to a tax-per-mile rate. Either way your paying it, either in the gas tank or yearly tax bill.

 

[#491]

For those of you who have spent much time overseas you will probably agree with me that the US is the most ass backwards country in regards to fuel economy mostly due the topic being discussed, gas taxes. Small 3 (and even 2) cylinder vehicles are all over the world and 60+ MPG is readily available in most parts of the world EXCEPT the US. Why? Taxes! Simple. Fuel choices are also better including regular gas (hardly used overseas), diesel (primary choice), propane and ethanol.

What incentive does the US and each state have in promoting fuel efficient vehicles? None! Simple again. I don't know exact numbers but I hear that close to 50% of the price you pay for gas is tax. Let’s say that’s roughly $1.50 per gallon and the "average" car gets 20 MPG. at 12k miles per year that's $900 a year in gas tax alone. Why would ANY local, state, or federal government want to give up that revenue. Like I said, no incentive.

The only way government will fully embrace highly efficient hybrid, electric, and "Elio" type vehicles is to fully abolish the gas tax and switch to a tax-per-mile rate. Either way your paying it, either in the gas tank or yearly tax bill.

But then again, the more I think about it, if we did away with the gas tax and gas was now $1.50 a gallon what incentive would their be for the Elio? Catch 22 I guess.

 

[Jelio]

NC is requiring those 49cc scooters to be titled and registered $15. They said its a law enforcement thing... yeah, mmmm

 

[Charlie G]

NC is requiring those 49cc scooters to be titled and registered $15. They said its a law enforcement thing... yeah, mmmm

One of the reasons states are doing this now is because people have been getting them after they can no longer drive due to DUIs/etc.
Without some registration/tag requirement, there's no way to know who's legally on the road.
Theft is also a potential problem - no tags makes them harder to track down.

Back when I was riding mine, it was tricky because Maryland wouldn't allow you to register/tag a 49cc scooter, but PA required it. Meaning as soon as you crossed the line you'd be illegal for not having a tag that you couldn't legally get.

 

[UCF'73]

For those of you who have spent much time overseas you will probably agree with me that the US is the most ass backwards country in regards to fuel economy mostly due the topic being discussed, gas taxes. Small 3 (and even 2) cylinder vehicles are all over the world and 60+ MPG is readily available in most parts of the world EXCEPT the US. Why? Taxes! Simple. Fuel choices are also better including regular gas (hardly used overseas), diesel (primary choice), propane and ethanol.

What incentive does the US and each state have in promoting fuel efficient vehicles? None! Simple again. I don't know exact numbers but I hear that close to 50% of the price you pay for gas is tax. Let’s say that’s roughly $1.50 per gallon and the "average" car gets 20 MPG. at 12k miles per year that's $900 a year in gas tax alone. Why would ANY local, state, or federal government want to give up that revenue. Like I said, no incentive.

The only way government will fully embrace highly efficient hybrid, electric, and "Elio" type vehicles is to fully abolish the gas tax and switch to a tax-per-mile rate. Either way your paying it, either in the gas tank or yearly tax bill.

I read that in the U.S. around 40 cents per gallon is tax, with about half of that federal and half state. Except for OPEC countries, the US has the lowest gas prices in the world, which explains in part why so many people can still afford to drive around in Explorers and Tahoe's. A per gallon tax is a convenient way to assess the tax because it doesn't require you to go to the Tax agency each year so they can read your odometer. It is also fair because the number of gallons you consume factors in both miles driven as well as miles per gallon. For my state anyway, I wouldn't mind if they raised the gas tax some in order to fix these crumbling roads.

 

[trock59]

It's a tricky issue, but I don't think adding tax to efficient vehicles is counterproductive - as long as it's less than you're saving on fuel economy.

Roads have to get paid for, that's really all there is to it.
You either tax everybody to pay for it equally, whether or not they use the road and regardless of how much - or you try to find a way to tax people who use them.

Historically, gas mileage has been garbage and relatively even. People who drove more bought more gas and thus paid more tax.

Now you've got a situation where there's people:

• driving a crappy old car with poor mileage because they can't afford any better
• driving a amp'd up muscle car that gets poor mileage because it's fun
• driving a powerful truck because they need it for work
• driving a expensive efficient car, just around town in retirement
• driving a efficient car thousands of miles a year to work

The trick is trying to figure out how to fairly apply taxes in every situation.
It's hard, people don't like paying for things.
If it were easy, it would be solved already.

Where I grew up our county had a local "excise tax" based on the vehicles weight which was paid yearly to the tax collector in addition to registration fees to the DMV. We could actually go to the collectors home and his wife would accept the payments!

 

[Charlie G]

A per gallon tax is a convenient way to assess the tax because it doesn't require you to go to the Tax agency each year so they can read your odometer. It is also fair because the number of gallons you consume factors in both miles driven as well as miles per gallon. For my state anyway, I wouldn't mind if they raised the gas tax some in order to fix these crumbling roads.

But the problem is that those statements aren't true anymore.
Someone can 'use' the road just as much in a electric, hybrid, or other HE vehicle as someone driving a gas car - but pay a far disproportionate amount of tax.

Lets do some comparisons using combined MPG, an average of 10k miles per year, and your .4/gal tax:

• 1985 Corvette at 17MPG, pays $235/year
• 1995 Chrysler at 19MPG, pays $210/year
• 2004 Ford Focus at 24mpg, pays $166/year
• 2012 Prius C at 50MPG, pays $80/year
• 2015 Elio at 70**MPG, pays $57/year
• 2013 Nissan leaf at 115MPGe, pays $0/year

All of the above cars are using the exact same roads almost the exact same amount, give or take some weight.
I understand incentivizing efficiency, but that's not what this is about.

 

[Jambe]

Unfortunately, this annual tax money is not earmarked to fix roads and bridges.

Neither is the gas tax.[/sarcasm]