Elio Erks Me To No End

[Ekh]

To all those screaming breech, specially (at the moment) Eliothegreat:

"At some point, if/when the vehicle is actually offered for sale and a binding contract is signed, there should be clear specifications on that agreement. If those specs are not met at time of delivery, I think both of us agree that that would constitute a breach."

What an interesting idea! Has anyone sued Ford or GM or Mazda because one of their models was a couple of horsepower or a couple of MPG off of spec? Does anyone NOT buy a Camry Hybrid because it only delivers 39-45 mpg instead of the 49 they advertise?

MPG ratings are NEVER 100% accurate because real-life driving isn't simulated driving. These days you can get pretty close, but as the advertisers say, "your mileage may vary."

And no one has ever gotten away with suing a start-up company because their price had to fluctuate.

Eliothegreat, you need to understand that a goal is not a contract. There is no breech. There may be failure to attain 100% of the anticipated results, but that is not a breech of any sort of contract, and in real life, nothing more than a variance. Yes, because Elio has been so loud and so steadfast in advertising "84mpg / $6800" they have built a real expectation with fans and the small part of the public that's actually aware of the project. That's why I think as soon as they're to about 98-99% they should change the line a bit -- maybe "more miles for your money than any car in the world." Or even just start stressing that 84/6800 is a goal.

But expectations aren't contracts. Expectations are feelings. Yours are hurt. And if you can't live without those extra couple of hundred dollars or miles per gallon, if the targets just can't be met, then you should make a decision -- is 98% going to give me a cool car that saves a ton of money, or is it more important to stamp my feet and yowl about my disappointment?

That's a choice every one of us may have to make. Me, I figure my tricked-out Elio will cost about 10K including tax and delivery fee, and worth every dime -- even if they're at a miserably inefficient 80 mpg.

So tantrum over expectations, or delight in something wonderful, you take your pick. I've made mine.

 

[RUCRAYZE]

Last winter in Chambersburg, PA I spent over $1,800 in unexpected electrical costs due to the winter cold. This winter I am again spending extra money but am better prepared so the shock is much less. Last year I had head blots strip on my beloved Toyota Camry 4 cylinder (36 mpg- not hybrid) and it cost me over $1,200.
There is over $3,000 that I hated to spend. I RISKED $1,000 ON AN IDEA- ELIO. I am standing with Paul. What if I lose my money? Well, while I am far from affluent (could never afford a Slingshot or Spyder) I believe in Paul's vision and am willing to take a risk to get a great deal at a great price for great mileage and a lot of fun. Besides, I can no longer ride a touring bike due to my arthritis and mistrust trikes with wide rear configurations. Too unstable for me. Elio- I await your arrival- 2015 or 2016

Welcome from the Sunny State of Florida. I'm sorry for your cold weather costs. But right on board with the M C riding. This site has it's share of beat-up rider. me 50+ and see the Elio as part of the continuum. Open trike, as you mentioned won't do it
Great bunch of folks, many with VERY deep understanding of production, design, engineering and like me expert at B.S.!
I wish us all the best

 

[RUCRAYZE]

To all those screaming breech, specially (at the moment) Eliothegreat:

"At some point, if/when the vehicle is actually offered for sale and a binding contract is signed, there should be clear specifications on that agreement. If those specs are not met at time of delivery, I think both of us agree that that would constitute a breach."

What an interesting idea! Has anyone sued Ford or GM or Mazda because one of their models was a couple of horsepower or a couple of MPG off of spec? Does anyone NOT buy a Camry Hybrid because it only delivers 39-45 mpg instead of the 45 they advertise?

MPG ratings are NEVER 100% accurate because real-life driving isn't simulated driving. These days you can get pretty close, but as the advertisers say, "your mileage may vary."

And no one has ever gotten away with suing a start-up company because their price had to fluctuate.

Eliothegreat, you need to understand that a goal is not a contract. There is no breech. There may be failure to attain 100% of the anticipated results, but that is not a breech of any sort of contract, and in real life, nothing more than a variance. Yes, because Elio has been so loud and so steadfast in advertising "84mpg / $6800" they have built a real expectation with fans and the small part of the public that's actually aware of the project. That's why I think as soon as they're to about 98-99% they should change the line a bit -- maybe "more miles for your money than any car in the world." Or even just start stressing that 84/6800 is a goal.

But expectations aren't contracts. Expectations are feelings. Yours are hurt. And if you can't live without those extra couple of hundred dollars or miles per gallon, if the targets just can't be met, then you should make a decision -- is 98% going to give me a cool car that saves a ton of money, or is it more important to stamp my feet and yowl about my disappointment?

That's a choice every one of us may have to make. Me, I figure my tricked-out Elio will cost about 10K including tax and delivery fee, and worth every dime -- even if they're at a miserably inefficient 80 mpg.

So tantrum over expectations, or delight in something wonderful, you take your pick. I've made mine.

Wonderfully written ,- but perhaps we're continuing to give this guy too much juice. He'll keep going as long as he gets attention. My suggestion, which I've begun to implement is reply- "thank you" w/o a" like-" let him write his one page crap, and we a few words."

 

[JEBar]

If you don't like what someone has to say, can't you just hit the 'ignore' button? Stop giving them the fuel they seek to continue. I haven't read anything that sinks to the 'ban' level.

individuals and moderators all have a shared interesting in maintaining the decorum of an internet community .... they also have a shared responsibility to maintain that decorum .... some members here choose to hit the 'ignore' button and that's fine .... some members choose to hit the 'report' button and that's fine .... some members choose to respond in keeping with the standards of the forum and that's fine .... moderators have to monitor the whole operation and work to maintain the standards of the forum .... all of that is as it should be .... having the ability to ban someone from the form is one necessary tool for a moderator .... as noted above, I believe the moderators here do an excellent job .... they have the ability to ban a person but manage the forum in a manner where, according to moderator statements, it has seldom been used

 

[Kuda]

Indeed, the guy's a total engineering wonk. That's no guarantee they will be in production or won't be. I do believe after observing his behavior for some time, he sincerely believes he will be producing the vehicle. That anyone else believes, well that's another matter.

 

[Thomas Maule]

I would be willing to buy the Elio even if it comes out with a 40/70 mpg rating, an $8000 price tag, and a 3 star crash rating... just dont tell paul.

 

[Rickb]

If you don't like what someone has to say, can't you just hit the 'ignore' button? Stop giving them the fuel they seek to continue. I haven't read anything that sinks to the 'ban' level.

I have.

 

[JEBar]

I would be willing to buy the Elio even if it comes out with a 40/70 mpg rating, an $8000 price tag, and a 3 star crash rating... just dont tell paul.

... outstanding ....

 

[Smitty901]

Last winter in Chambersburg, PA I spent over $1,800 in unexpected electrical costs due to the winter cold. This winter I am again spending extra money but am better prepared so the shock is much less. Last year I had head blots strip on my beloved Toyota Camry 4 cylinder (36 mpg- not hybrid) and it cost me over $1,200.
There is over $3,000 that I hated to spend. I RISKED $1,000 ON AN IDEA- ELIO. I am standing with Paul. What if I lose my money? Well, while I am far from affluent (could never afford a Slingshot or Spyder) I believe in Paul's vision and am willing to take a risk to get a great deal at a great price for great mileage and a lot of fun. Besides, I can no longer ride a touring bike due to my arthritis and mistrust trikes with wide rear configurations. Too unstable for me. Elio- I await your arrival- 2015 or 2016

Happy I bought Fords after see cost like that.
Side car works and not hard to master.

 

[Jim H]

Last winter in Chambersburg, PA I spent over $1,800 in unexpected electrical costs due to the winter cold. This winter I am again spending extra money but am better prepared so the shock is much less. Last year I had head blots strip on my beloved Toyota Camry 4 cylinder (36 mpg- not hybrid) and it cost me over $1,200.
There is over $3,000 that I hated to spend. I RISKED $1,000 ON AN IDEA- ELIO. I am standing with Paul. What if I lose my money? Well, while I am far from affluent (could never afford a Slingshot or Spyder) I believe in Paul's vision and am willing to take a risk to get a great deal at a great price for great mileage and a lot of fun. Besides, I can no longer ride a touring bike due to my arthritis and mistrust trikes with wide rear configurations. Too unstable for me. Elio- I await your arrival- 2015 or 2016

Bruce-Boy, welcome to the forum and congratulations on your reservation. There are many of us who share your feelings about supporting Paul Elio's dream and have made it our dream too. There are many diverse personalities on this forum with diverse experiences. Enjoy the experience and the journey.