Reservations: 65341 As Of 6/20/2017

[Spyche Chaos]

Out of all the spiteful, hateful, politically charged terms folks use to refer to one another on this forum unchallenged, you're going to censor the word "clown"?!

ROFLMAO.

 

[eliothegreat]

No faith required. Vehicles rolling off the line is entirely in Elio Motors hands to accomplish or not. Though along that journey I think there are things of interest those of us along for the ride can look at to help make sense, e.g. https://hbr.org/2012/05/six-myths-of-product-development

IMHO, that is one of the best posts you have ever made. Great job! The Elio project is not a religion, and does not require "faith". It requires good business skills. That was a really good article as well. It would seem to be more of an indictment of Elio's practices and history than praise for them. Perhaps you could send it along to Paul, though I think that it is to late to get through to him.

 

[John Painter]

Nice read- what makes you think Paul Elio understands any of these concepts well enough to actually bring the Elio to market? He's already failed once in Michigan, and his engineering firm in AZ wasn't a success, either.

It's possible he was a really great cab driver; I have seen no reports to the contrary.

Probably the same things that make you think he does or does not understand any of those concepts. But enough on relativity. In my opinion and experience, not all entrepreneurs get things right the first time, or second, etc though they are all dogmatic about what ever they're into, I see Elio that way. I agree that does not equate to a vehicle rolling off the line, though I see no way for anything to roll off any line without that dogmatism, and however inconsequential the accomplishments of Elio Motors so far, it's more than existed in 2008 and I think less than what will exist in 2022. I'm not sure about PE's cab driving skills, but I have heard he knows his way around minivans!

 

[eliothegreat]

Nice read- what makes you think Paul Elio understands any of these concepts well enough to actually bring the Elio to market? He's already failed once in Michigan, and his engineering firm in AZ wasn't a success, either.

It's possible he was a really great cab driver; I have seen no reports to the contrary.

I'm not sure that experiencing failure precludes future success. Many, if not most, successful people have failed repeatedly before (or even after) achieving success. Personally, most of the successes I've had in life have been based on the lessons I learned from previous failures.

The real question is whether and what we learn from our failures. From my point of view, the major lesson that Paul Elio (ESG engineering failure, Elio Motors Inc round 1 (2008-2011)), Dave Schembri (Smart USA no profit/poor sales), Jim Holder (Chrysler loss of $.5B in the quarter before his firing) all seem to have learned from their failures is "If you're going to lose money, it's better to lose other people's money rather than your own."

 

[Rickb]

5/3/15 42,288
166 week
23 day

None of my local car dealers are selling 166 vehicles a week and they have an actual product to sell. It truly is a phELIOnomina.
EM is generating enough reservation money to pay salaries, cover everyday business expenses, and keep marketing the Elio on tour and at major events. It seriously is time to Start building and testing (prototypes) and stop dreaming. Time is so very short.

 

[Spyche Chaos]

 

[Spyche Chaos]

I'm not sure that experiencing failure precludes future success. Many, if not most, successful people have failed repeatedly before (or even after) achieving success. Personally, most of the successes I've had in life have been based on the lessons I learned from previous failures.

The real question is whether and what we learn from our failures. From my point of view, the major lesson that Paul Elio (ESG engineering failure, Elio Motors Inc round 1 (2008-2011)), Dave Schembri (Smart USA no profit/poor sales), Jim Holder (Chrysler loss of $.5B in the quarter before his firing) all seem to have learned from their failures is "If you're going to lose money, it's better to lose other people's money rather than your own."

Right, but a record of failure isn't a predictor of success, either. I mean, if targets were being met, benchmarks achieved, etc., then more confidence might be warranted, but it's clear that's not so.

 

[Ty]

The whole "nobody understands how hard it is to build things" argument is getting pretty tired, IMO.

Lots of people build things.

It's not like Paul Elio is the world's first manufacturer; he makes a point of saying as much when he talks about what a breeze it will be to crank out 250,000 vehicles per annum (despite only 42k actual reservations from possible future customers).

Lots of people understand how hard it is.

That's exactly why I think _______ doesn't have a clue, a prayer, or a plan.

Isn't that precisely why Paul hired people who are experts at manufacturing and all that other stuff? Yes. Yes, it is. He has a plan and part of that plan is to bring in experts to handle the things he doesn't know about. Read up on the team he has assembled. It seems he is making the right decisions there.

 

[Spyche Chaos]

Isn't that precisely why Paul hired people who are experts at manufacturing and all that other stuff? Yes. Yes, it is. He has a plan and part of that plan is to bring in experts to handle the things he doesn't know about. Read up on the team he has assembled. It seems he is making the right decisions there.

Uh, I did read up on it. I just didn't make the same conclusions.

 

[Ty]

Uh, I did read up on it. I just didn't make the same conclusions.

Fair enough. I think it wise of Paul to hire people who know vehicle manufacturing, to leave engine design to professionals, Comau was picked to set up the factory, existing manufacturers are building all the parts. All Elio has to do is assemble the parts. Well, a couple other things too, but still, it's not like Elio has to learn how to stamp out body panels or make a door handle or hinge or windshield. Having walked the line many a time, I can tell you that at the GM plant, there weren't any difficult processes. Designing the vehicle, obtaining equipment, setting up the assembly line, arranging logistics, securing manufacturing partners, and finding a factory are the truly difficult tasks. It seems Paul has the right skill-set in his company to make all that happen.