Electric Vehicle Thoughts, Questions & Answers

[ThreeWheelBurnin]

Funny, I just saw somebody post this on facebook Isn't that a beautiful picture of the Gobi desert? But honestly, I could care less about how many holes China drills in their desert. I like electric cars for their performance characteristics, for their cheap fuel, and for their reduced maintenance costs. No oil changes no transmission problems reduced break pad wear no noise or grease or exhaust fumes

I like being able to take a nap in my EV on a hot day at lunch time without filling the parking garage with exhaust fumes while my AC runs.

 

[Sethodine]

Well, to make it interesting, what motor/controller/battery would you suggest at the moment, given cost and range being two priorities?
Who could do such a conversion for a viable price?
It would be nice to spec out the thing as an FYI here.

The nice thing about EV is you can have a dragster level of power and still have reasonable range, so long as you don't use it that way.
For example, a single Warp 7 motor is good for a 1400lb vehicle and about right for the Elio with batteries.

Although, I am kind of attracted to dual motor setups.

Most are interested in single wheel drive, Gary's (link) as an example. Gary has expressed interest in my Atlantric project, if I'll ever get it done!

Oh, and if all the "what pieces should I use" gets too complicated, Canadian Electric Vehicles offers complete conversion kits and lots of documentation and help for your EV conversion. I've read lots of good things about them! They also do kits tailored to specific vehicles, so it wouldn't surprise me if an Elio kit becomes a thing from them in the coming years. (I'm also really liking the look of their electric Mini trucks ).

Their "Universal" kit comes with a Warp 9.

 

[Marshall]

Funny, I just saw somebody post this on facebook Isn't that a beautiful picture of the Gobi desert? But honestly, I could care less about how many holes China drills in their desert. I like electric cars for their performance characteristics, for their cheap fuel, and for their reduced maintenance costs. No oil changes no transmission problems reduced break pad wear no noise or grease or exhaust fumes

I'm close to that. I'm cheap, not green. But if Green is cheap. I'm all in.

 

[AriLea]

An article reminded me of something worth noting, maintenance. Except for the batteries, EV are phenomenal in reliability and low maintenance..
article link on the Testa for that. And for batteries, except for replacement they are as low as gas tanks, more or less. Although, there are lab-in-work cathode-annode upgrades trying/succeeding at getting up to 10x the life from battery power as well. Someday, someday....

Tesla's CEO, announced that they're further beefing up protection by extending the warranty on the drivetrain of the 85 kWh Model S (the most popular one by far) to match the battery; this means that for 8 years, you get a full warranty that includes an infinite number of miles, with no limits on the number of owners to the EV!

 

[AriLea]

Little bit of futurism for battery tech around Zinc-Manganese Oxide chemistry, from a Gizmag Article , the top quote below is the bottom-line stats, and then some quotes from around the web to compare with... But I wonder what they mean as comparable cost, per watt or per pound or per use? Devil is in the detail!

GIZMAG: Power dense zinc-manganese power unit as cheap as a car battery ... And it worked. The researchers claim that the tiny test battery achieved a storage capacity of 285 mAh per gram of manganese oxide over an extraordinary 5,000 cycles, with 92 percent of its initial storage capacity retained.

Wiki Ref: Today's electric vehicles rely on nickel-metal hydride batteries. They are heavy, bulky and have a specific energy that is too low, about 80 watt hours per kilogram (Wh/kg), for long-distance travel. Li-ion batteries, commonly used in handheld electronics, offer greater capacity. Composed of three main components—a graphite anode, a cathode and electrolyte (lithium salt dissolved in organic solvent)—the graphite anode has specific capacity of about 350 mAh/g. Li-ion batteries using graphite anodes exhibit a specific energy of more than 160 Wh/kg, double that of nickel-metal hydride batteries

FAQ Ref: Manufacturers take a conservative approach and specify the life of Li-ion in most consumer products as being between 300 and 500 discharge/charge cycles.

FAQ Ref #2: AT maximum Lithium has high specific capacity (3840 mAh/g)

Science paper Ref: Microsheets Test reached 420 mAh/g, vs the theoretical 372 mAh/g limit for graphite. The anodes survived 300 charging cycles without a significant capaicty loss.

Science paper Ref: Scientists at Pacific Northwest National Laboratory developed a lithium-ion (Li-ion) battery technology with reversible capacity of more than 1,600 milliamp hours per gram (mAh/g) after 40 charging/discharging cycles.

 

[Sethodine]

That....is very confusing. It's like no single source can even agree on what the capacity for Lithium Ion is... and then trying to compare mAh/g to Wh/Kg, without reference to voltage???

 

[Truett Collins]

Funny, I just saw somebody post this on facebook Isn't that a beautiful picture of the Gobi desert? But honestly, I could care less about how many holes China drills in their desert. I like electric cars for their performance characteristics, for their cheap fuel, and for their reduced maintenance costs. No oil changes no transmission problems reduced break pad wear no noise or grease or exhaust fumes

Shall we put the next mine in your community?

 

[Sethodine]

Shall we put the next mine in your community?

No? Thankfully, North America's apalling lack of Lithium deposits means that won't be necessary.

 

[AriLea]

That....is very confusing. It's like no single source can even agree on what the capacity for Lithium Ion is... and then trying to compare mAh/g to Wh/Kg, without reference to voltage???

Well, yes, some of that was a bit old, you can't always find a date from a web reference.

I read it as, much more than 300ah/g per gram is possible for Li, but the ah/g for the ZMO lab test is about as dense as what production Li has, but with a lot more cycles possible. If the purchase pricing stands-up equal to Lead-Acid by weight (big if), it's a definite advantage over Li chemistry.
The bigger deal here is the 5000 cycles. If you use your car to the recommended discharge 250 times a year, that's 20 years of use. Possibly above the expected useful life of an EV car, which would then be about double the average working life of a gas-powered car.

 

[Marshall]

Shall we put the next mine in your community?

Only if you want a community swimming pool. We hit the water table at about 5 feet in my area. But I'm sure the alligator and turtle populations would love it.