The Elio Engine

[Ekh]

Recently watched a show on Velocity channel showing the build of a new Lamborghini 12-cyclinder engine. They exposed the cast iron sleeves to liquid nitrogen before inserting them into the block. As they returned to ambient temperature they expand slightly. Very tight fit. These engines are proven technology and in some of the most expensive cars in the world. Go Elio!

Believe it or not, I was once part of a muzzle loading artillery "regiment" that had a cannon built up that way, by heating one pipe and chilling the other in dry ice until they would slip together and pressure weld. 12 layers done this way made up the barrel of the cannon. Shot amazingly accurately (beer cans full of cement, run through a sizing die for uniformity)>

 

[wesley]

when the elio releases a new and updated model I wonder if it will be possible to put the new generation engine in the old (soon to come) model. I remember hearing that a turbo may be an option farther down the line, and who knows maybe it'll top 100 mpg. I probably won't want to trade up, I get emotionally attached to my vehicles.

 

[Lil4X]

I think I read a recent bulletin where IAV is looking at a couple of modifications to the crankcase castings to support bosses for a bolt-on turbo. It looks like this might require a swap of intake and exhaust plumbing to products that would bolt up to the turbo, and the addition of an oil tap to lube and cool the turbo bearings. Now, either a new ECM or just a re-flash, and presto! turbo!

As for internal modifications to the engine, you'd think that you'd want to lower compression just a bit to prevent detonation, and maybe destroke the engine a bit to allow higher RPM for optimal turbo performance, but a "light pressure" turbo might do fine without all of this internal work.

Given the existing engine, a turbo might benefit from an electric boost to spool up the turbo almost instantly, rather than depend on exhaust gases to drive the turbo from low RPM. Tests run on a couple of aftermarket "electric" turbos have done well on 1-liter engines, eliminating turbo lag. Drivers report that performance is seamless, with no lag, and no sudden lurch as the boost comes in.

The only downside to this approach is that it requires a separate battery to drive the compressor stage, even though it's not used but for a couple of seconds before the engine exhaust can provide sufficient power to drive the turbine. The last I heard, this "boost battery" might be replaced by a large capacitor, either of which would be charged with a slightly larger capacity alternator.

 

[skygazer6033]

A lot of talk about turbos (personally not for me) and having to beef up the bottom end. If the engine is designed to utilize 11.5-12 to 1 compression ratio as we've been told with a redline of 65-6800 it probably won't need much modification. Forged low compression pistons, studs for main bearing and cylinder head hold down and stainless steel composite head gasket should be good for any street levels of boost. (100-115 HP for this engine)

 

[harlan stephens]

I think spray bore is a bad idea...
This is a high compression motor.
And a long stroke...
If it is sleaved there are no issues.
Works for the alumnator now as it did with the corbras...both na and supercharged.
Not one spray bore in ford racing catalog.
One should ask why is this.
I have personally seen plated bores wipe out motors....
Never a problem with tried and true sleaved aluminum blocks.

 

[JEBar]

I think spray bore is a bad idea....

concern understood .... I can't speak for anyone else but things like this make it very clear to me that innovations have moved on and in many areas I haven't .... I well remember when they went to aluminum blocks with sleeves, I thought the idea couldn't work .... I mean after all, how could an aluminum block stand up against a cast iron block .... they did have some problems at first but as you noted those issues have been resolved .... the data I've seen (mostly coming from this forum) seems to indicate that spraying is the way of the future

 

[harlan stephens]

In about 2010 it seemed that way...
Today is see many have turned away from the idea...
Also work that could be done in any machine shop ...now can not.
The only upside I can think of here is inital cost. Long term there will be problems.

 

[Truett Collins]

I think spray bore is a bad idea...
This is a high compression motor.
And a long stroke...
If it is sleaved there are no issues.
Works for the alumnator now as it did with the corbras...both na and supercharged.
Not one spray bore in ford racing catalog.
One should ask why is this.
I have personally seen plated bores wipe out motors....
Never a problem with tried and true sleaved aluminum blocks.

http://www.growthconsulting.frost.c...2E7FFF401B652576E4003789EA/$File/TI_Alert.htm
http://articles.sae.org/7624/
http://www.mustangandfords.com/news...-gt500-trinity-5-8l-v8/spray-bore-liners.html
http://www.themotorbookstore.com/4-6-liter-ford-engine.html

Seems Ford disagrees with you.....

 

[harlan stephens]

Please look at fords current products.
Not one spray bore in the line up.
Or ford racing products. Not one spray bore in the line up...as per 2014..

I say this as a hot rod guy on both cars and bikes and am the proud owner of a 10k motor that a plated liner whiped the whole motor out.
Belive what you wish.
However all 2014 ford aluminum motors are now thin wall pressed in liners....why did they change direction?

 

[PITTSBURGH]

I haven't raised any concerns about it on any forum but I'll confess, I've been a bit concerned with the all-aluminum engine. Not only bad experience with an early '70's vehicle with aluminum heads but a dozen years as a machinist and now twenty-five years as a mechanical designer cause me to worry a bit. Cast iron sleeves in an aluminum block don't ease my worries any. If you understand the difference in the thermal expansion rate of aluminum vs. cast iron, you know why. But after a little research, I feel better. Here are a couple of excerpts for those who don't want to dig too deep and a link for those who might.

http://www.flame-spray.com/

"An important goal for engine manufacturers is to reduce fuel consumption, which can be accomplished by decreasing overall vehicle weight and improving engine efficiency by reducing the internal friction losses. Substantial weight savings can be achieved with the use of aluminum engines. However, most aluminum engines require cast iron liners to be used as the wear surface. Additional weight savings and potential friction reduction can be achieved by replacing these heavy cast iron liners with a low friction, wear resistant PTWA coating on the cylinder bores. Additional benefits of PTWA in new production engines include improved heat transfer and decreased bore distortion, which reduces friction loss and oil consumption."

"Flame Spray Inc., Port Washington, N.Y.,announces that the Plasma Transferred Wire Arc coating process has been selected by Ford Motor Co. to coat the internal surface of the aluminum engine block cylinder bores in the Ford Shelby GT500 sports car. PTWA provides a lower cost and lower weight alternative to cast iron liners, while delivering increased displacement in the same size engine package, and a potential for better heat transfer."