This "green Thing"

[electroken]

While overall it's a nice tirade, there are a couple of problems with it:

Grocery stores bagged our groceries in brown paper bags, that we reused for numerous things, most memorable besides household garbage bags, was the use of brown paper bags as book covers for our schoolbooks.
This was to ensure that public property, (the books provided for our use by the school) was not defaced by our scribbling's. Then we were able to personalize our books on the brown paper bags. But too bad we didn't do the green thing back then.
This is still a requirement in the Shelton, Connecticut school system. Some of the books might actually be from "the good old days".

Back then, we had one TV, or radio, in the house -- not a TV in every room. And the TV had a small screen the size of a handkerchief (remember them?), not a screen the size of the state of Montana. It's true that my parents had one television in 1968. It had a 25" screen and drew 380 watts of power. Today, the three televisions in my house use a total 260 watts. That's if all 3 are on simultaneously, and they aren't.

And we didn't need a
computerized gadget to receive a signal beamed from satellites 23,000 miles out in space in order to find the nearest burger joint.
OK, this is a bit of a nit-pick, but GPS satellites are in medium-Earth orbit at a bit less than 13,000 miles altitude.

Some of the good old days weren't very "green" at all. It was common practice to pour used motor oil into the ground. Here, in the Naugatuck River valley you could tell what the metal finishers upstream were plating by what color the river ran that day. I, for one, don't miss that.

 

[Charlie G]

It's a self aggrandizing sarcastic chain email posted to a forum.

Those things weren't done because any generation was better or more environmentally conscious.
That's just how it was.
Then we pushed the boundaries of industry, science, and cheap labor to convince people to spend money for convenience.
And they did, and they got spoiled and complacent.
And now we're trying to go backwards, convincing people to exchange convenience and low-cost for environmentally friendly alternatives.
That is "the green thing".
It's trying to convince people to spend more for less because it's less wastefully produced.
It's trying to convince people to take the stairs instead of the elevator even though it's there.
It's trying to remind people to bring their own bags to the store, even though they're free.

I'm not a hypocrite, I don't pretend to be a very 'green' person myself - but that post got me pretty angry.

There's an implication there. If the 'older generation' was "green before 'green' was a thing", it seems to imply that "Its you young people with all your conveniences that aren't green" - right?
The problem is that I'm nearly 30 and grew up with computers in my house. My generation didn't invent them. We didn't invent the energy drink. We didn't invent the disposable razor, the disposable diaper, the plastic grocery bag, the washing machine etc etc etc. We grew up with them, yes - but we didn't invent them. Guess who did?
Really, with the exception of some software advances, my generation hasn't really gotten a chance to do much yet.

 

[zelio]

It's a self aggrandizing sarcastic chain email posted to a forum.

Those things weren't done because any generation was better or more environmentally conscious.
That's just how it was.
Then we pushed the boundaries of industry, science, and cheap labor to convince people to spend money for convenience.
And they did, and they got spoiled and complacent.
And now we're trying to go backwards, convincing people to exchange convenience and low-cost for environmentally friendly alternatives.
That is "the green thing".
It's trying to convince people to spend more for less because it's less wastefully produced.
It's trying to convince people to take the stairs instead of the elevator even though it's there.
It's trying to remind people to bring their own bags to the store, even though they're free.

I'm not a hypocrite, I don't pretend to be a very 'green' person myself - but that post got me pretty angry.

There's an implication there. If the 'older generation' was "green before 'green' was a thing", it seems to imply that "Its you young people with all your conveniences that aren't green" - right?
The problem is that I'm nearly 30 and grew up with computers in my house. My generation didn't invent them. We didn't invent the energy drink. We didn't invent the disposable razor, the disposable diaper, the plastic grocery bag, the washing machine etc etc etc. We grew up with them, yes - but we didn't invent them. Guess who did?
Really, with the exception of some software advances, my generation hasn't really gotten a chance to do much yet.

You are correct except for there are always many advances by every generation that few are familiar with. I remember something my parents insisted when I became an environmentally conscious person - it doesn't matter what we do to the environment because science will find a way to fix it. They both died at the age of 88 in the 1990s. I was raised on a farm where DDT was routinely used - definitely not a beneficial gift from science as far as health matters go. The same goes for Agent Orange. Unfortunately many of the things that have been touted as scientific break throughs for improving our lives have in fact only been beneficial to the bottom line of the company producing them. At almost 73 I have 2 children who have seen many wonderful things and places but I have no grandchildren, yet. Still I am concerned about the loses we experience all in the name of progress. Since I am currently on one of those scientific breakthroughs called a medical prescription that will benefit me but at the same time is scrambling my brain, I had better shut up while I still almost make sense. (I am very grateful I only have 5 pills left to take because I truly hate having a scrambled brain!) :-) Z

 

[Mike W]

It's a self aggrandizing sarcastic chain email posted to a forum.

Those things weren't done because any generation was better or more environmentally conscious.
That's just how it was.
Then we pushed the boundaries of industry, science, and cheap labor to convince people to spend money for convenience.
And they did, and they got spoiled and complacent.
And now we're trying to go backwards, convincing people to exchange convenience and low-cost for environmentally friendly alternatives.
That is "the green thing".
It's trying to convince people to spend more for less because it's less wastefully produced.
It's trying to convince people to take the stairs instead of the elevator even though it's there.
It's trying to remind people to bring their own bags to the store, even though they're free.

I'm not a hypocrite, I don't pretend to be a very 'green' person myself - but that post got me pretty angry.

There's an implication there. If the 'older generation' was "green before 'green' was a thing", it seems to imply that "Its you young people with all your conveniences that aren't green" - right?
The problem is that I'm nearly 30 and grew up with computers in my house. My generation didn't invent them. We didn't invent the energy drink. We didn't invent the disposable razor, the disposable diaper, the plastic grocery bag, the washing machine etc etc etc. We grew up with them, yes - but we didn't invent them. Guess who did?
Really, with the exception of some software advances, my generation hasn't really gotten a chance to do much yet.

A lot of great points there. From my experience, if the advances of modern science weren't in the house it was because we couldn't afford them. I also think that quite possibly the myth of ancient man being green is just that. They weren't green to honor the earth and their family, they had no choice but to use everything but the "oink". It's just how it was. Once people got more affluent they didn't worry so much about not squeezing every little bit out of their resources. Although, science unintentionally has come to the rescue in at least 2 examples that I can think of, the rescue of the sperm whale and the unburying of major cities across the country from horse poo in the late 19th/early 20th centuries. Kerosene ended the near mass extinction of the sperm whale. Kerosene was as effective as oil whale and cheaper, voila! The automobile rescued major cities around the world from horse poo and horse carcasses so plentiful that it was becoming a major health hazard. The old western movies with their clean but dust blown streets? Nope, it may have been dusty but there was more horse poo laying around than you could shake a stick at. And when it rained... well you get the picture. So the picture of "scientific advancement" is both good and bad. The generations before you do owe you a mea culpa for making a mess of things.

With that being said, the last sentence-"Really, with the exception of some software advances, my generation hasn't really gotten a chance to do much yet." is emotional foolishness. Hasn't gotten a chance to do much yet? 30 years should be enough time to do something. I also take umbrage to the helplessness you cast your generation as being in. There are many of your age trying to make a difference but sadly there are also many guilty of committing what you point out about past generations. I think your generation is no more different than mine or my parents or their parents, maybe more hightech but the same. Each generation finds some way to make scientific advances to improve life and also the mistakes that come with it. So take a careful look and assess the scientific advances made and used quite cheerfully in modern society before you start chucking rocks.

Meanwhile, know that getting the Elio is a great first step! Go find another step to take, every little bit helps. Take your canvas grocery bag to the grocery store, learn to shave with a straight razor, use cloth diapers, wash dishes by hand. Wait a minute, that sounds a lot like my parents and grandparents. Everything old is new again!

 

[Charlie G]

With that being said, the last sentence-"Really, with the exception of some software advances, my generation hasn't really gotten a chance to do much yet." is emotional foolishness. Hasn't gotten a chance to do much yet? 30 years should be enough time to do something.

At 30 you've only been out of high school for 12 years, college for maybe 8, higher degrees even less. Not sure exactly what major technical advances you're expecting out of fresh grads, but what I'm saying is we haven't been around long enough to be major players in the development of science and new tech. If you assume retirement at 55 (which is less likely than ever these days) and a 1-in-1-out hiring scheme (for simplicity sake) that makes college grads my age or under only 8/55ths or <15% of the current white collar work force, and they're starting at the bottom if they can even get a job.

I'm not trying to portray my generation as helpless, I'm trying to point out that they have barely even gotten started.

While much of what I said may have been accusatory, it was from a defensive position. It came from a sense of being judged for the world I was born into, and that goes both ways. Saying the environment is the prior generations fault isn't fair for the same reasons they can't claim superiority for a 'green' childhood. That's really where the root of this stems from. The original post had the cashier blaming the older woman for not caring about the environment - that's not fair. But when the older woman goes on and on and on about how she's superior to the young woman, that isn't right either.

 

[Mike W]

At 30 you've only been out of high school for 12 years, college for maybe 8, higher degrees even less. Not sure exactly what major technical advances you're expecting out of fresh grads, but what I'm saying is we haven't been around long enough to be major players in the development of science and new tech. If you assume retirement at 55 (which is less likely than ever these days) and a 1-in-1-out hiring scheme (for simplicity sake) that makes college grads my age or under only 8/55ths or <15% of the current white collar work force, and they're starting at the bottom if they can even get a job.

I'm not trying to portray my generation as helpless, I'm trying to point out that they have barely even gotten started.

While much of what I said may have been accusatory, it was from a defensive position. It came from a sense of being judged for the world I was born into, and that goes both ways. Saying the environment is the prior generations fault isn't fair for the same reasons they can't claim superiority for a 'green' childhood. That's really where the root of this stems from. The original post had the cashier blaming the older woman for not caring about the environment - that's not fair. But when the older woman goes on and on and on about how she's superior to the young woman, that isn't right either.

Ok first of all, let's forget the generational thing. Let's take it to it's bottom line. What are the individuals in whatever generation doing to help in "this green thing?" We need the people with degrees to come up with the big solutions, that's true, but we shouldn't and can't leave it up to them alone. The grass roots, the individual is just as vital. The little daily things we do determines a lot too. I can hear you say,"Oh yeah point out one big problem solved by the grass roots!". In 3 words, Give a hoot! If you were alive in the 60's your reply would be, "Don't Pollute! The highways of America were extremely trashed ridden, America was driving everywhere, and so was trash. Not just the Interstate system but everywhere. It was this "Give a hoot" campaign taken to heart by the common man, with a college education or not, that cleaned up the highways and byways. It took a while but it was done. (No, today's occasional trash along the highway is not in any way comparable to the late 50s/early 60s.) So forget the college degree or any such thing. The individual counts in this effort. The bit about the straight razor, cloth diapers and washing dishes by hand was said somewhat in jest but really not. The individual can and does make a difference. No one can or should hide behind age, social strata, college degree, race or belief as a reason for lack of personal action. It really isn't "this green thing" it's life as we know it and what we are willing to do to keep it?

 

[BrianRosenthal]

...The grass roots, the individual is just as vital.

Think globally, act locally.

 

[Jim H]

Think globally, act locally.

Right out of the UN Agenda 21 play book.

 

[Mike W]

Right out of the UN Agenda 21 play book.

Ok, Think locally, act locally. Just act.

 

[ross]

It's a self aggrandizing sarcastic chain email posted to a forum.

Those things weren't done because any generation was better or more environmentally conscious.
That's just how it was.
Then we pushed the boundaries of industry, science, and cheap labor to convince people to spend money for convenience.
And they did, and they got spoiled and complacent.
And now we're trying to go backwards, convincing people to exchange convenience and low-cost for environmentally friendly alternatives.
That is "the green thing".
It's trying to convince people to spend more for less because it's less wastefully produced.
It's trying to convince people to take the stairs instead of the elevator even though it's there.
It's trying to remind people to bring their own bags to the store, even though they're free.

I'm not a hypocrite, I don't pretend to be a very 'green' person myself - but that post got me pretty angry.

There's an implication there. If the 'older generation' was "green before 'green' was a thing", it seems to imply that "Its you young people with all your conveniences that aren't green" - right?
The problem is that I'm nearly 30 and grew up with computers in my house. My generation didn't invent them. We didn't invent the energy drink. We didn't invent the disposable razor, the disposable diaper, the plastic grocery bag, the washing machine etc etc etc. We grew up with them, yes - but we didn't invent them. Guess who did?
Really, with the exception of some software advances, my generation hasn't really gotten a chance to do much yet.

When Christopher Columbus 'Discovered' America in1492 the native Indian (so named only because said 'Discoverer' thought he was in India) was already spread 'from sea to shining sea'. The lodge, teepee, or whatever abode, belonged to the woman of the house, white man called Squaw, she was responsible for all domestic duties. The man hunted and fished and was responsible to 'bring home the bacon'. White man shows up and thinks he can improve on this system. When one of Lewis and Clarks party couldn't go back to St Louis after what he'd seen and instead 'Discovered' Yellowstone, there was a native 'Indian' (remember we're in India) standing behind a tree asking his buddy 'Who are those Pale Faces and what do they want?'
All it would have taken was for the natives at Plymouth Rock to invite the 'Pale Faces' to a Thanksgiving Feast, feed them some turkey, mashed potatoes and gravy and some corn, wait for them to fall asleep and then three flaming arrows. One in the Nina one in the Pinta and one in the Santa Maria. Send word back to Spain. You are right.The world is flat. Sail over the horizon and fall of the edge of the earth. What a great country this would be. Of course we wouldn't be here, but still....