The Elio Engine

[Ty]

I'm sure I'm oversimplifying this, but since a solenoid is just an electromagnet, just make it spring-loaded to the closed position in case of a coil failure or voltage loss. I'm just going by the solenoids I've seen on HVAC stuff like humidifiers.

That makes sense. I know the valves will have a spring of sorts that pulls it back in. If a solenoid fails due to lack of power, it will retract. If something physical happens to make it fail in the open position, there would be trouble.

 

[RSchneider]

You have to look at it as you can't make it 100% foolproof if you are wanting any sort of efficiency out of it. If we didn't care about efficiency, we'd just make cast iron 2 valve low compression engines that don't rev very high. Since we do want efficiency, we have to accept there will be some increased percentage of error that can cause damage. I would think that manufacturers would be looking for a system with a return spring on a valve but pushed open with oil instead of air. In most modern engines, they use the oil system to drive things like the variable cam timing and valve lift. The oil system is already there, so it becomes a on board system they can expand.

 

[McBrew]

I would think that manufacturers would be looking for a system with a return spring on a valve but pushed open with oil instead of air. In most modern engines, they use the oil system to drive things like the variable cam timing and valve lift. The oil system is already there, so it becomes a on board system they can expand.

That's how my car works. Take a look at Fiat MultiAir.


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[Ekh]

In response to the momentum piece that was just published, it had one bit of factual news. The engine weighs 181 pounds. I assume that is with accessories but not including fluids.

I find this interesting because Elio has been extremely cagey in releasing anything related to actual weights and measures. Yet here it is.

I also found it interesting that they are migrating components like the alternater from location to location. It makes sense that they're doing this; they have to accommodate a lot of other stuff taking up space in the engine bay. That's in addition to the stated reasons about better balance and so forth. Releasing the weight number tells me they really are about done with engine development. Which means in turn that a lot of other things have been locked down. Oh and one more thought... it seems that the alternator has a huge capacity 120 amps. Anybody know what's up with that?

 

[electroken]

Oh and one more thought... it seems that the alternator has a huge capacity 120 amps. Anybody know what's up with that?

That's a ton of capacity for a vehicle without a rear window defogger. Maybe they'll offer an accessory pizza oven.

 

[Johnny Acree]

Well the root answer is "the 4 must haves" The detail answer goes something like this.
Engineering request an alternator that fits in a space and puts out a min. # amps.
Procurement request quotes and all spec. from suppliers for all available units that meet these min spec. and can deliver in the volume required. They look not only at amp rating, but weight, engine load at specif output, reliability and a bunch of other stuff. Then they pick the one that best hits the mark.
Even if it puts out 120 amps.

 

[McBrew]

Well the root answer is "the 4 must haves" The detail answer goes something like this.
Engineering request an alternator that fits in a space and puts out a min. # amps.
Procurement request quotes and all spec. from suppliers for all available units that meet these min spec. and can deliver in the volume required. They look not only at amp rating, but weight, engine load at specif output, reliability and a bunch of other stuff. Then they pick the one that best hits the mark.
Even if it puts out 120 amps.

I'm sure it has a lot to do with using off-the-shelf parts. However, modern cars also have quite a bit of electronics packed into them. One of my previous cars had power windows and rear window defogger, but it only needed a 55 amp alternator. What it didn't have was a bunch of electronics attached to the engine, climate control, safety systems, in car entertainment, etc.

A rear window defogger is usually only active for a few minutes. All the electronics in the car or in use pretty much all of the time.


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[Ty]

I'm telling you... simple contact switch on the dash to make the starter spin. Use it as you leave from a dead stop to help with MPG AND quickness. Put that alternator to work recharging the battery after starting out like that each time.

 

[Sethodine]

I'm telling you... simple contact switch on the dash to make the starter spin. Use it as you leave from a dead stop to help with MPG AND quickness. Put that alternator to work recharging the battery after starting out like that each time.

Using the starter to make it, essentially, a hybrid? Interesting idea. Would you need more batteries, or do you think a single 12v, 750a battery would suffice?

 

[Frim]

I'm telling you... simple contact switch on the dash to make the starter spin. Use it as you leave from a dead stop to help with MPG AND quickness. Put that alternator to work recharging the battery after starting out like that each time.

Seems like the starter Bendix would need to be a little more robust if it were routinely used to boost the car acceleration.