A Reason For Range Anxiety

[Sethodine]

Very exciting!

Maybe someday I will be able to replace the battery in my Leaf; instead of an 84 mile battery that costs $5000, I will get a 250 mile battery for just $1600

I know, invention-to-production has been decades apart in the past, but all it takes is somebody like Elon Musk saying, "that will be perfect for my Tesla, I will start making those cells at the Gigafactory".

 

[AriLea]

Very exciting!

Maybe someday I will be able to replace the battery in my Leaf; instead of an 84 mile battery that costs $5000, I will get a 250 mile battery for just $1600

I know, invention-to-production has been decades apart in the past, but all it takes is somebody like Elon Musk saying, "that will be perfect for my Tesla, I will start making those cells at the Gigafactory".

It does let you know how much this scared the automakers in the past.
If the cars last 20years with little or no maintenance, it hugely changes to business model for dealers and parts supply, plus reduces demand for new autos over time.

 

[Sethodine]

It does let you know how much this scared the automakers in the past.
If the cars last 20years with little or no maintenance, it hugely changes to business model for dealers and parts supply, plus reduces demand for new autos over time.

I think automakers will adapt. There is always new features or goodies that people want, even if their current car runs good. For as much as I like our 2012 Leaf, I wouldn't want to hold onto it even with a new battery. The 3.3kw onboard inverter is just too slow of charging compared to the higher power ones on newer EVs, and it doesn't have a DC Fast Charge socket either. Our 2013, on the other hand, has both a 6.6kw inverter and a DC-FC port, so it has greater longevity in my mind.
The Chevy Bolt and Toyota Rav-4 EV both have 7.2kw inverters, so they can charge even faster with a powerful enough charger. When purchasing a home station, I made sure to get one that could go up to 7.2kw in preparation for the future.

 

[AriLea]

Just checking a couple prices on google,

Bulk Lithium battery grade $20/kg
Bulk Extracted Sodium $2.8/kg

Doesn't tell me the total cost of a battery per kw, but does suggest 1/3 per pound is possible.
So if 3x the density stand up, and if 3x the longevity, yea OK 1/27 the cost over the life of the vehicle given the car is used for the full life of the battery.

I should note, rolling around in a car with reduced battery weight increases range just by itself.

 

[booboo]

Good header for this comment. Me questioning the current state of solid state. Until there is a viable way to power a vehicle that does not mean using up finite resources, I will refrain from singing the praises of EV's.
Flux capacitors, Fuel cells, there has to be greener alternatives.
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...en-if-it-means-destroying-precious-ecosystems
" The special metals found in rich deposits there are critical for smart electronics and crucial green technologies, such as solar power and electric cars. But as the world’s population rises, demand is now outstripping the production from mines on land for some important elements."

 

[Ty]

Good header for this comment. Me questioning the current state of solid state. Until there is a viable way to power a vehicle that does not mean using up finite resources, I will refrain from singing the praises of EV's.
Flux capacitors, Fuel cells, there has to be greener alternatives.
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...en-if-it-means-destroying-precious-ecosystems
" The special metals found in rich deposits there are critical for smart electronics and crucial green technologies, such as solar power and electric cars. But as the world’s population rises, demand is now outstripping the production from mines on land for some important elements."

There's always steam power... been using that forever. You can run them off of wood and that is at least not finite.

 

[Sethodine]

Or sodium-glass batteries. That's a new development, from the same guy who invented the Lithium-Ion battery. Sodium-glass are solid-state batteries that are 3-5 times more energy dense than lithium batteries, and can be made from salt extracted from seawater.

His team also came up with a solid-state Lithium-glass battery, which is even better. So good, in fact, that other scientists have openly claimed it must be bad data, because they don't believe it is possible. Basically, the amount of energy in the 600lb battery that powers my Leaf could fit into a 19lb lithium-glass battery, and charge 5 times faster.

Both solid-state designs have cycle lifetimes several-fold compared to lithim ion, so a car with such a battery could run on it for 10-20 years with little loss in performance.

 

[Elio Amazed]

Nothing against you Seth...

But like all fantastic new developments we hear about, it'll be "just around the corner" for another thirty years.

 

[airforceguy6]

Or sodium-glass batteries. That's a new development, from the same guy who invented the Lithium-Ion battery. Sodium-glass are solid-state batteries that are 3-5 times more energy dense than lithium batteries, and can be made from salt extracted from seawater.

His team also came up with a solid-state Lithium-glass battery, which is even better. So good, in fact, that other scientists have openly claimed it must be bad data, because they don't believe it is possible. Basically, the amount of energy in the 600lb battery that powers my Leaf could fit into a 19lb lithium-glass battery, and charge 5 times faster.

Both solid-state designs have cycle lifetimes several-fold compared to lithim ion, so a car with such a battery could run on it for 10-20 years with little loss in performance.

Cant wait to see these technologies actually put to use! Elio Amazed does have a point that they do take time to develop and market (I think 30 years is a little stretch) but I could see these types of improvements being available to the public in the next 5-10 years.

 

[Sethodine]

Oh I'm well aware of the development timeline. But I only just turned 30, so I'm only about 10% of the way through my life at this moment. I still have many years ahead of me to wait for these fine dreams.