Dieselio

[KN16]

I know my truck gets better mileage than a gasoline equivalent but DANG, those oil changes are expensive! and let's not even get started about the Exhaust Fluid (yes, that's a real thing). I think the negative connotation that still follows diesel engines around (smoky, noisy, stinky, ... thank you, early VW attempts) would keep some people away from a diesel Elio. However, I think those negative connotations are going away. I also read somewhere that one of the auto manufacturers worked out how to build an engine that runs on gasoline but can "diesel" the way diesel engines do which increases their efficiency by letting them start up like a conventional gasser and switch to diesel (no ignition, high compression) at speed.

I could see a small diesel Elio down the road somewhere but the return on investment would be a long time coming as JNR pointed out.

Yep but smaller engine lower maintenance cost.

Urea is certainly a PIA, but as a motorcycle they could likely get by without it. This BTW has more to do with why you can't get the diesel smart not some baseless conspiracy theory.

 

[Ty]

Yep but smaller engine lower maintenance cost.

Urea is certainly a PIA, but as a motorcycle they could likely get by without it. This BTW has more to do with why you can't get the diesel smart not some baseless conspiracy theory.

True. I'd get a diesel if it were offered. Oil company conspiracy theories are always funny to me. We couldn't even hide stealth technology, much less a global spanning, huge impact conspiracy. LOL

Diesels can be a PITA in cold weather! 4 years at Minot, ND... I've earned the right to claim that. But, I wouldn't give up my diesel truck... Anti-gel stuff is a must.

 

[Velnias]

Please don't get offended but that's absurd. It's not easy to get a smog compliant diesel anymore. This caused earthquakes in the big truck market. Caterpillar stopped making truck engines for North America because they didn't want to deal with it any more.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it's the truth. Even California's "strict" EPA ratings for vehicles are lower than China's standards for vehicles. The USA's standards for emissions is in fact the lowest in the industrialized world. You are just letting their propaganda fool you like it does most of the rest of the nation. Currently over in Europe they are using several times the ammount of diesel engines we are in cars. They also have much higher mileage averages with less polution because their standards are some of the highest in the world. It's ok if you don't want to believe it, but it's the truth. They have vehicles legal over there getting 60mpg and more that can't come over here on the bogus excuse of EPA ratings. The truth of it is that their systems are more efficient w/o using the same tech we require cars to have that is based on 50 year old technology. Feel free to not believe in the truth, you wouldn't be alone in that one.

 

[JNR]

..... They have vehicles legal over there getting 60mpg and more that can't come over here on the bogus excuse of EPA ratings. ...

I read this over and over, but I've also seen that the European mpg is based on Imperial gallon. FYI, 1 US gallon = .83 Imperial gallons.

So if they get 60 mpg using imperial gallon and using the correct conversion we would get 49.8 mpg for a US gallon.

I'm not wrong about the conversion, it is what it is, but it is possible you have already factored the conversion.

Also the EPA cycle is not the same test cycle to the European standard, I did not read up on that yet in detail, so I am only taking peoples words for it on blogs, but wouldn't be surprised if that skews the comparison as well.

 

[Velnias]

I read this over and over, but I've also seen that the European mpg is based on Imperial gallon. FYI, 1 US gallon = .83 Imperial gallons.

So if they get 60 mpg using imperial gallon and using the correct conversion we would get 49.8 mpg for a US gallon.

I'm not wrong about the conversion, it is what it is, but it is possible you have already factored the conversion.

Also the EPA cycle is not the same test cycle to the European standard, I did not read up on that yet in detail, so I am only taking peoples words for it on blogs, but wouldn't be surprised if that skews the comparison as well.

The reports I've read did the conversion from kilometer per liter (which is what they actually use) to our miles per gallon. So the imperial gallon was never actually a factor. As for the difference in standards. EU has continued to update their standards and use the most stringent of regulations for their equivalent of EPA standards. This is due to their governments having more control over industry rather than industry having more control over the government as the USA has. In the USA our EPA standards are based on 50 year old technology and hasn't really changed much over the years. They require exhaust systems to use components that are very obsolete and no longer the best for emissions control while not quite addressing the overall emissions themselves. Don't beleive me? Look at all the states that don't even have an emissions test or standard for vehicles and tell me that our EPA isn't a joke.

 

[JNR]

The reports I've read did the conversion from kilometer per liter (which is what they actually use) to our miles per gallon. So the imperial gallon was never actually a factor...........Don't beleive me? Look at all the states that don't even have an emissions test or standard for vehicles and tell me that our EPA isn't a joke.

I have no dog in the fight, I only care about accuracy and efficiency that is why I was checking. I believe that frequently people forget to convert because I've seen the argument before on facebook that the Elio is crap because someone's diesel Volvo in Europe was already getting high 70's or 80 mpg.

So if you could provide links to what vehicles get 60 mpg in Europe, that would be great. I lived there for a short time in late 90's and comparing car for car is not a good comparison, our compacts (Honda Civics) were their family cars, and most young people I knew drove micro cars (i.e. Ford Fiesta/Festiva's - I forget)

 

[Ty]

I have no dog in the fight, I only care about accuracy and efficiency that is why I was checking. I believe that frequently people forget to convert because I've seen the argument before on facebook that the Elio is crap because someone's diesel Volvo in Europe was already getting high 70's or 80 mpg.

So if you could provide links to what vehicles get 60 mpg in Europe, that would be great. I lived there for a short time in late 90's and comparing car for car is not a good comparison, our compacts (Honda Civics) were their family cars, and most young people I knew drove micro cars (i.e. Ford Fiesta/Festiva's - I forget)

I was interested also and so I read the Top 10 list of European cars... all 10 get better than (our equivalent test) 80 MPG. It's not a matter of European cars being better (The top car on the friggin list is the Chevy Volt, for crying out loud). It's more likely that Americans won't buy fuel efficient cars for whatever reason "I don't want to get smashed by a big truck", "I can't see over Hummers." The landscape is slowly changing here and I'm starting to see what looks like a much smaller vehicle demographic. What I mean is that it seems that there aren't as many of the huge vehicles on the road. Now, some people "need" a large vehicle (a Prius won't pull my 30' car hauler) but I'm talking about not seeing as many mostly empty huge vehicles on the road. As that changes, our "corporate fuel economy" averages will go up. I wonder how much Ford is helped by the fact that they finally have an economic version of the F-150 that people actually buy. That is just one example where manufactures are making more fuel efficient vehicles that people will actually buy. The 1986 Chevy Sprint got 44/53 MPG but were unpopular and thus didn't sell well.


Here's that top 10 list :

http://cars.uk.msn.com/features/green-motoring/top-10-most-economical-cars

 

[HoofHearted]

I thought most European fuel efficiency ratings were rated at litres/100km. The lower the number the better. Or maybe that was just Great Britain and Canada.

 

[Ty]

I thought most European fuel efficiency ratings were rated at litres/100km. The lower the number the better. Or maybe that was just Great Britain and Canada.

The article I quoted converted them so we would understand. You are correct that they use Litres/100km which is supposed to make it easier to compare two vehicles.

 

[goofyone]

The article I quoted converted them so we would understand. You are correct that they use Litres/100km which is supposed to make it easier to compare two vehicles.

Actually the article you mentioned is from the UK where, unlike mainland Europe, they do measure vehicle fuel efficiency in MPG. This does make it easier to compare to the US but we still have to convert UK Imperial MPG to the US MPG. You can use this site for that:

http://www.unitjuggler.com/convert-fuelconsumption-from-mpgimperial-to-mpg.html

By the way the highest rated non hybrid car on the list is #6, the Hyundai i20 1.1 CRDi Blue, which is a diesel and would get 73.5mpg when converted to US gallons. This is still not as good as the Elio is expected to do using gasoline which is also about 10% less expensive than diesel.