Sondors Electric Car

[acentre]

Like Electra Meccanica, Sondors will not be having to "pour a foundation" for a large facility themselves.
Thus eliminating the lion's share of those costs. They built prototype #1 on chump change...
And they have projected that they can get to production by bid for another $20M.
(Which they're now well into the process of raising).

Compare that to the Elio expenditure to get to... well, where they're at now. Perpetually 'mostly ready'.
I'd hardy call being in need of $370M+ to begin production "Mostly set up and mostly ready to go."

The Chinese will be working for Sondors, not the other way around.

How much has Elio raised over the year. Would it equal $20mil?
The Chinese have a proven manufacturing record and are only improving every day.

 

[Made in USA]

What laws are those exactly?
I've put a bit of study into this and to my knowledge, the Sondors meets the motorcycle (with the wide side-by-side seating configuration considerations) requirements.
Do you have any links to substantiate this?

Besides, Sondors has projected that their production vehicle will have airbags, seatbelts and ABS.

Sorry if you misunderstood. The Slingshot and Morgan are open air vehicles. The Sondors will be classified as a motorcycle UNLESS, the Autocycle Bill is passed with modifications. The current bill would leave out all the enclosed three wheelers that are rear wheel driven (like the Sondors). IF the bill is modified to include rear wheel driven, then Sondors (and others) will have to meet higher standards. As an enclosed vehicle, it is implied that they will be "all weather" vehicles. How many rear wheel driven three wheelers (open or closed) do you see out in rain or snow? As three wheeled vehicles are inherently less stable than a four wheeler, they are more likely to lose traction in the back of the vehicle. The Elio has a long wheelbase and being front wheel driven will have less tendency to fishtail. So the question about laws is really about how the NTSB will apply current terminology and laws, and then what new standards will be created to address any safety concerns. Not to be political, but if the Sondors is made by a Chinese company and our trade with them goes south, then they may not be allowed to be imported because of many reasons.

 

[wizard of ahs]

I laughed out loud! When I pick it up you would have to explain the black rubber donut like marks on the street in front of your house.

You'd only be adding to the ones already there

That's very generous of you Whiz.

Just trying to do my part

 

[Elio Amazed]

Sorry if you misunderstood. The Slingshot and Morgan are open air vehicles. The Sondors will be classified as a motorcycle UNLESS, the Autocycle Bill is passed with modifications. The current bill would leave out all the enclosed three wheelers that are rear wheel driven (like the Sondors). IF the bill is modified to include rear wheel driven, then Sondors (and others) will have to meet higher standards. As an enclosed vehicle, it is implied that they will be "all weather" vehicles. How many rear wheel driven three wheelers (open or closed) do you see out in rain or snow? As three wheeled vehicles are inherently less stable than a four wheeler, they are more likely to lose traction in the back of the vehicle. The Elio has a long wheelbase and being front wheel driven will have less tendency to fishtail. So the question about laws is really about how the NTSB will apply current terminology and laws, and then what new standards will be created to address any safety concerns. Not to be political, but if the Sondors is made by a Chinese company and our trade with them goes south, then they may not be allowed to be imported because of many reasons.

"While their prototype looks nice and the expected range is good, I don't see the government allowing it to be produced or imported under the current safety laws. Changes will have to be made probably by both Sondors and the law makers."
I had to re-read your original post just to make sure that I didn't misunderstand. You said, "current safety laws".
This last post comes basically comes down to: "Unless", "If" and "if".

"As an enclosed vehicle, it is implied that they will be "all weather" vehicles."
Nothing has been implied by these companies about great inclement weather traction and/or FWD-like stability.
But if someone were to be inclined to make a very long stretch between something being enclosed and therefore being an AWV/ATV, well...
A reasonable, responsible person of driving age should recognize the difference in FWD vs RWD in regard to wet/winter performance on any vehicle.

While I believe that a FWD Elio would have somewhat better all-weather stability than a RWD Sondors, it hasn't been proven.
The Elio snow video showed the Elio taking sweeping corners at low speed on a hard-packed surface.
And even then, I don't know what you saw, but I saw some slight drifting going on.

"IF the bill is modified to include rear wheel driven, then Sondors (and others) will have to meet higher standards."
What higher standards are those? Please explain what you KNOW to be higher standards that the Sondors production model will lack.

"Not to be political, but if the Sondors is made by a Chinese company and our trade with them goes south, then they may not be allowed to be imported because of many reasons."
An almost impossible long shot. If our trade with the Chinese "goes south", both economies will crash.

 

[RUCRAYZE]

The Polaris Slingshot and Morgan 3 wheeler (ICE and EV) are available in the US and are rear wheel drive. Maybe they do not sell in enough volume to trigger updated safety laws?

when you take into account the slingshot seems put together and designed from dissonant pieces and the Morgan is super expensive toy, you can easily see why low volume. You should also included the T-Rex on your list-

 

[Elio Amazed]

Two interesting FAQs from the new Sondors title IV investment page.

"Are you taking any deposits for the vehicle?
No, we are not currently taking any deposits.

When will I be able to buy one?
We have no plans to take any pre-sales until our vehicle is ready for production."

The page also states:
"In the next 60 days, we're raising $2 million to complete a production ready Model SONDORS.
We'll then work to raise the additional funds necessary for production tooling and testing."
"Our intent is to meet and exceed automotive safety standards."
"A few of our safety features include a passenger safety cell, safety belts, air bags, anti-lock brakes, and traction stability control."

https://www.startengine.com/sondorscar?mc_cid=74458e1c81&mc_eid=2b7afce8cc

https://electrek.co/2017/12/01/sondors-3...dollar-ev/

 

[Maurtis]

The page also states:
"In the next 60 days, we're raising $2 million to complete a production ready Model SONDORS.
We'll then work to raise the additional funds necessary for production tooling and testing."

$2 million seems really inexpensive to go from prototype to production ready, but how do you have a production model without testing? "You could produce this model, but you would not want to." LOL

Seems they are playing loosey-goosey with terminology there. Which I am okay with if it helps them raise money, but feels dirty. That would be like calling the Elio P3 a production ready model, with the P1/P2 being the prototype.

 

[Elio Amazed]

$2 million seems really inexpensive to go from prototype to production ready, but how do you have a production model without testing? "You could produce this model, but you would not want to." LOL

Seems they are playing loosey-goosey with terminology there. Which I am okay with if it helps them raise money, but feels dirty. That would be like calling the Elio P3 a production ready model, with the P1/P2 being the prototype.

That's not the situation at all.

The next step to get to production is raising $2M to build the engineering prototype.
Or "Production Ready Model Sondors" for those who aren't bothered by what's in a name.
And then $18M more for testing, mods and tooling.

By only raising $2M at a time for now, they can stay away from A+ but still offer the investment opportunity to unqualified investors.

They've estimated that building the engineering "production ready Model Sondors" will take several months.
They've also estimated that after it's complete, testing, modification and tooling will take at least another six months.

As far as the terminology, what else are you going to call the next prototype that, after testing and mods will be the production ready model...
If not a production ready model? If you call it anything else at any stage of it's existence, won't that just confuse the public?

On the other hand, you couldn't, by the wildest stretch, call the P3 a production ready model...
Because, hopefully, somewhere in the succession of models that have come, and will come, after the P3...
There will be will actually be a true production ready model.

 

[Rickb]

Pre-production model.

 

[Elio Amazed]

Pre-production model.

I don't agree. It still confuses the definition of the vehicle that's actually going to be used for tooling.

IMO, it's only an issue if one is intentionally looking for nits and negatives.
I believe their communication and intended meanings are pretty clear.
And that this is simply a case of "You say tom-a-to, I say tom-au-to."

When they're done with it, it should be everything that the vehicles coming off the line will be.

And slight differences? Hence the word "MODEL is being used".