Separate names with a comma.
Welcome to Elio Owners! Join today, registration is easy!
Discussion in 'Elio Drivetrain' started by Floyd, Dec 21, 2013.
The low power and low torque of the Elio should fit the CVT very well.
I'd like to see it researched.... after a year or two of active production.
Long, long ago in a survey far away, EM sent a letter to us asking how much more we would pay for an automatic transmission. I believe they gave three prices and the lowest was approximately $1050. All these prices are very high for a box of servos to sit on top of a manual transmission and control a clutch and shift forks. I believe they were at that time exploring the possibility of using a truly automatic transmission (traditional or CVT) to replace the Automated Manual Transmission (ANT).
Does anyone remember the prices they quoted? The numbers were not in the email. They were at the EM website to which he had to go in order to vote.
I was concerned about gas mileage of the AT and asked EM about the automatic transmission and got this reply listed below from EM.
They confirm in items 2 and 3, that the transmission is a AMT and gave several existing cars with the AMT.
The best discussion about the AMT I found is at this link.
Elio Motors Customer Service (Elio Motors)
Sep 26, 17:54 EDT
Thanks for your email Curtis- great thoughts.
1) Great suggestion, but this does not cover everything we have done to accomplish our objectives. At this time we cannot discuss in depth what has been accomplished in our team. Although many other companies are producing vehicles with the same or higher compression ratios.
2) Our AMT is based off of the manual transmission and is expected to have the same MPG per the current results. The trend in CAE is currently showing the AMT slightly better due to greater control of the shifting compared to a person shifting.
3) Yes there are existing cars in the European and Asian areas utilizing the same transmission as Elio. There have been produced for many years and have shown a proven performance for reliability and quality. We believe these are accepted in those regions because of the demand for manual transmissions and the culture being developed with those configurations. Our experience with a vehicle shipped over to the US was positive in the performance displayed during driving the vehicle. The Toyota Aygo, Peugeot and Citroen use the same transmission along with others, in the future. Performance vehicles will be using the same system in the future. The clutch system for the manual and AMT work the exact same with the exception of actuators for shifting.
The Elio Team
I'm curious why Elio went with the 5 speed over the 6 speed? Is a 6 speed really that much more expensive? With how they've talked about how they're gonna tune the transmission to be as fuel efficient as possible, you'd think if they did the same thing with a 6 speed it'd net them even more MPGs, perhaps bringing it up to ~90+ on the freeway.
Any time, any one ask, WHY did Elio do anything. Here is the answer.
The 4 Must Haves
Before we even put design pen to paper, these four Elio “Must-haves” were etched indelibly in our minds and hearts. Here are the results:
Must-have 1: Amazing MPG
While other vehicles make their competitive claims within a few MPGs of one another, we needed Elio to take it to the stratosphere. As we continue to engineer the Elio for up to 84 MPG, we officially have liftoff.
Must-have 2: Uncompromised Safety
Elio is engineered to the highest safety standards. Each Elio comes equipped with a Safety Management System that includes three airbags – a unibody frame, Anti-Lock Braking System, and 50% larger crush zones than similar vehicles. Watch video.
Must-have 3: All-American Pedigree
Elio is American-made targeting utilization of 90% North American content, and we have re-engineered existing technology throughout. That means no trial and error anywhere. Just tried and true everywhere.
Must-have 4: Low Price
It seems like everything just costs more today. Houses, cars, heck, even a gallon of milk and a box of cereal. At Elio Motors, we believe wallets need a break. A new vehicle targeted $7,450* base price is not just what people want. It’s what they need.
Your answer is #4 in the above post. 5 speed is cheaper. This is the same reason why Elio is not using direct injection, 4 valve and variable cam timing. Even though a 990 cc 3 cylinder gasser with a 4 valve head and variable cam timing is much more efficient than what Elio is using, it just costs more. There are more parts. Elio has told us that things like the hood hinges from the front because they only need one latch as opposed to two like all other cars have. That was to save cost. Same as for the reason for one door as opposed to two.
If Elio gave what everyone wanted, the car would cost $15K. What you do is you set a price and give people what they are willing to put up with and know that you are not trying to screw them over. It's the same business plan that the low cost airlines used. If you ever go to Europe, they have really cheap flights but you know what you are getting into. They took what Southwest did in the US and went further and we now see this in the US with all of the other low cost airlines. Want to bring on a bag and use the overhead compartment, it'll cost you. Want to pick your seat, it'll cost you. If you are looking for basic transportation to get you from point A to B, then you can put up with cheap. Want to have all of the luxuries, then fly a traditional airlines. Just don't complain that you are not getting free peanuts and drinks when you pay $50 for a flight, go spend $300 then.
This is what Elio is doing. Want an automatic, you gotta pay. Want retro wheels, same thing. Honestly, Elio should have made AC an option because there are people that could live without it. Since all of the blue chip suppliers don't make roll up windows and manual locks any more, those items are actually cheaper than if they were the old manual versions. This is one thing that Elio is falling behind on because some other technologies are getting so cheap (i.e. digital instrument cluster) that they will be the norm on 90% of the cars by the time the Elio is out in 2020.
Yes, Elio could make a 150 mpg car for $20K but people can't afford a $20K car today and many need to break out of the poverty cycle with affordable reliable transportation. In the end, everyone will have to put up with what Elio gives you. If you are wealthy then you get all of the options and have fun. Since the Elio is marketed not as a toy, then it needs to not be equipped like one.
It is a KISS vehicle!
Jumping in at the end here but as someone with a 6 speed auto I think it would be overkill on the Elio. My Toyota 86 has both 5th and 6th as overdrive. The gearing on each is close and fuel usage is within margin of error. On a light car with low wind resistance like the Elio I doubt .the car would need it. They could probably just put their 5th where other cars need a 6th gear.
I still want a CVT but I think those cost too much for Elio