Energy Department Revives Fuel-efficient Vehicle Loan Program - March 26, 2015 - Wsj.com

[John Painter]

View attachment 5649

FPL is not a good measure of liveable wage for a variety of reasons, though it does provide a consistent point from which states and other federal programs can make determinations of what other social service programs or entitlements people might be eligible for.

 

[Johnapool]

View attachment 5649

Federal Poverty Level (FPL) A measure of income level issued annually by the Department of Health and Human Services. Federal poverty levels are used to determine your eligibility for certain programs and benefits.

Understating Poverty
In addition to wage and salary income, investment income and government transfers such as SNAP (also known as food stamps) and housing subsidies are included in a household's income. Studies measuring the differences between income before and after taxes and government transfers, have found that without social support programs, poverty would be roughly 30% to 40% higher than the official poverty line indicates.

Further, the U.S. Census Bureau calculates the poverty line the same throughout the U.S. regardless of the cost-of-living in a state or urban area. For instance, the cost-of-living in California, the most populous state, was 1.42 times the U.S. average in 2010 while the cost-of-living in Texas, the second most populous state, was 0.90 (90%) of the U.S. average.

In 2015, in the United States, the poverty threshold for a single person under 65 was at an annual income of US$11,770; the threshold for a family group of four, including two children, was US$24,250. According to the U.S. Census Bureau data released on September 13, 2011, the nation's poverty rate rose to 15.1 percent in 2010.
In 1776, Adam Smith argued that poverty is the inability to afford "not only the commodities which are indispensably necessary for the support of life, but whatever the custom of the country renders it indecent for creditable people, even of the lowest order, to be without."[20][21]

In 1958, John Kenneth Galbraith argued, "People are poverty stricken when their income, even if adequate for survival, falls markedly behind that of their community."[21][22]

In 1964, in a joint committee economic President's report in the United States, Republicans endorsed the concept of relative poverty: "No objective definition of poverty exists. ... The definition varies from place to place and time to time. In America as our standard of living rises, so does our idea of what is substandard."[21][23]

In 1965 Rose Friedman argued for the use of relative poverty claiming that the definition of poverty changes with general living standards. Those labelled as poor in 1995, would have had "a higher standard of living than many labelled not poor" in 1965.[21][24]

In 1979, British sociologist, Peter Townsend published his famous definition: "individuals... can be said to be in poverty when they lack the resources to obtain the types of diet, participate in the activities and have the living conditions and amenities which are customary, or are at least widely encouraged or approved, in the societies to which they belong (page 31)."[25]

Brian Nolan and Christopher T. Whelan of the Economic and Social Research Institute (ESRI) in Ireland explained that "poverty has to be seen in terms of the standard of living of the society in question."[26]

Relative poverty measures are used as official poverty rates by the European Union, UNICEF and the OEDC. The main poverty line used in the OECD and the European Unionis based on "economic distance", a level of income set at 60% of the median household income.[27]

 

[John Painter]

JEBar,
Sorry about continuing with the off topic stuff but can someone please give me the definition of a "living wage".

That will vary quite a bit by state, and even by municipality within a state, e.g. the cost of living and access to just about everything is quite different between the towns of Portland and Moose River. There should be data on line from your state's health and human services department or department of labor somewhere.

 

[WilliamH]

Federal Poverty Level (FPL) A measure of income level issued annually by the Department of Health and Human Services. Federal poverty levels are used to determine your eligibility for certain programs and benefits.

Understating Poverty
In addition to wage and salary income, investment income and government transfers such as SNAP (also known as food stamps) and housing subsidies are included in a household's income. Studies measuring the differences between income before and after taxes and government transfers, have found that without social support programs, poverty would be roughly 30% to 40% higher than the official poverty line indicates.

Further, the U.S. Census Bureau calculates the poverty line the same throughout the U.S. regardless of the cost-of-living in a state or urban area. For instance, the cost-of-living in California, the most populous state, was 1.42 times the U.S. average in 2010 while the cost-of-living in Texas, the second most populous state, was 0.90 (90%) of the U.S. average.

In 2015, in the United States, the poverty threshold for a single person under 65 was at an annual income of US$11,770; the threshold for a family group of four, including two children, was US$24,250. According to the U.S. Census Bureau data released on September 13, 2011, the nation's poverty rate rose to 15.1 percent in 2010.
In 1776, Adam Smith argued that poverty is the inability to afford "not only the commodities which are indispensably necessary for the support of life, but whatever the custom of the country renders it indecent for creditable people, even of the lowest order, to be without."[20][21]

In 1958, John Kenneth Galbraith argued, "People are poverty stricken when their income, even if adequate for survival, falls markedly behind that of their community."[21][22]

In 1964, in a joint committee economic President's report in the United States, Republicans endorsed the concept of relative poverty: "No objective definition of poverty exists. ... The definition varies from place to place and time to time. In America as our standard of living rises, so does our idea of what is substandard."[21][23]

In 1965 Rose Friedman argued for the use of relative poverty claiming that the definition of poverty changes with general living standards. Those labelled as poor in 1995, would have had "a higher standard of living than many labelled not poor" in 1965.[21][24]

In 1979, British sociologist, Peter Townsend published his famous definition: "individuals... can be said to be in poverty when they lack the resources to obtain the types of diet, participate in the activities and have the living conditions and amenities which are customary, or are at least widely encouraged or approved, in the societies to which they belong (page 31)."[25]

Brian Nolan and Christopher T. Whelan of the Economic and Social Research Institute (ESRI) in Ireland explained that "poverty has to be seen in terms of the standard of living of the society in question."[26]

Relative poverty measures are used as official poverty rates by the European Union, UNICEF and the OEDC. The main poverty line used in the OECD and the European Unionis based on "economic distance", a level of income set at 60% of the median household income.[27]

Would it be possible to stop this line of discussion?
If you really want to talk about it, I'm sure there is a social welfare blog somewhere that would encourage this discussion.
This however is not that place.

 

[CompTrex]

I'm enjoying the commentary. FWIW...

 

[WilliamH]

I'm enjoying the commentary. FWIW...

But what does it have to do with the status of the DoE ATVM loan program or the factual requirements for eligibility?
Or the status of Elios loan application?

 

[CompTrex]

But what does it have to do with the status of the DoE ATVM loan program or the factual requirements for eligibility?
Or the status of Elios loan application?

nothing.
It's still an interesting topic of discussion.

 

[NSTG8R]

Would it be possible to stop this line of discussion?
If you really want to talk about it, I'm sure there is a social welfare blog somewhere that would encourage this discussion.
This however is not that place.

Kind of with Comp on this one as far as it being an interesting topic, but you're right, it has nothing to do with the original DoE topic and could easily be its own thread in the "General Discussion" section.

 

[Johnapool]

OK, no more posts from me off-topic on this thread- promise.
As to the discussion about the loan- what else could possibly be said about it? It is applied for, some hoops have been jumped through, it is, like lots of other things on our forum, just a waiting game now. So, while we wait, it is common to discuss other subjects. To the Gen. Disc. section with us all!!!!

 

[WilliamH]

OK, no more posts from me off-topic on this thread- promise.
As to the discussion about the loan- what else could possibly be said about it? It is applied for, some hoops have been jumped through, it is, like lots of other things on our forum, just a waiting game now. So, while we wait, it is common to discuss other subjects. To the Gen. Disc. section with us all!!!!

Angry mob of Elio reservation holders attack DoE loan office?