What Is The Latest Start Production Date?

[Doug McDow]

If I could get a "guarantee" that my ELIO would be delivered on an exact date, I would gladly send in the full amount due.
That would give me a motivation to live longer.

That makes two of us! I agree!

 

[slinches]

They'd need about half of the reservationists to pay in full to raise the $200 million they need to start production.

If they did it like a Kickstarter campaign (funds held in escrow and only released to EM if the goal is met), I'd be willing to put my money down ahead too.

 

[Ty]

First thing to do is for Elio to change his business plan. Obviously the current one is not working. Many businesses could be saved with a huge influx of cash but that's just a band aid solution and it's not the right direction for Elio. Paul can't keep standing out at an intersection with a sign, "Will build car for food" when what he really want's is money. You have to readjust the current model.

- First thing that needs to be known is how much money and timeline to get the car to production?
- What is the minimum amount of engineering cars that need to be built?
- Forget the 100 fleet as it's a waste of money because nobody is going to buy a pre production car and do your testing for you.
- What specifications can you back off on (i.e. 84 mpg, 90% NA content, crash rating, NVH, power door locks, electric windows, etc).
- Can this be built in a much smaller plant?
- Can we only start off with building 100/month and then increase from there?
- What should the real base price be?
- Can we build it with the only option being color (standardize where every car is the same and no options at all)?
- Can we use an existing driveline from something else (i.e. Mitsubishi Mirage)?
- Give up a certain amount of control and bring in an active partner who will work with you on day to day activities (a second opinion)?

I know that everyone can rip those suggestions all apart but there gets a point where if you don't change, you'll never make a product at all. Paul has been pushing this product for years and for a while it looked good with suppliers signing up, getting reservations, selling stock, being on TV and touting the product but the tide has turned and unless you turn the ship, you'll just run it aground. I see this with businesses where they had a successful business plan for a while yet the world changed around them and they watch their business go downhill because they won't swallow some pride and change. Compromise is not a bad thing but many fear it.

Why do you assume that Paul's business model isn't working? Because we don't get our Elios when we want? Paul hasn't sold or lost Elio Motors yet so I'd say he's doing okay in that respect. It sucks not having a car and it sucks that the published timelines seem to pass by. But, think about this - Doing what he's done has gotten 65,000 people to put down deposits on a vehicle. He's got a factory, a design, several prototypes, and legislation done. He's done all this without selling out. He's done this on HIS schedule, not ours. It's easy to sit back and say "I would have gotten someone rich to bankroll this thing." Yeah, and then that someone rich gets all the profits... What does it really matter to Paul if this endeavor takes another year or two? Really, what does it matter? Let's pretend he's delayed long enough to piss off every single reservationist. Would that stop Elios from being built? Would a new investor care about some past investors? Maybe not. Perhaps Paul is a real genius in his business practices. How could we possibly know any different at this point?

 

[3wheelin]

That makes two of us! I agree!

But see that's just the thing, we all want a guarantee, but without a clue how much money EM really needs to get to the finish line, not very many will be willing to do it and risk their hard earned money!

 

[3wheelin]

They'd need about half of the reservationists to pay in full to raise the $200 million they need to start production.

If they did it like a Kickstarter campaign (funds held in escrow and only released to EM if the goal is met), I'd be willing to put my money down ahead too.

Now there's an idea that's foolproof! That makes two of us!

 

[3wheelin]

Why do you assume that Paul's business model isn't working? Because we don't get our Elios when we want? Paul hasn't sold or lost Elio Motors yet so I'd say he's doing okay in that respect. It sucks not having a car and it sucks that the published timelines seem to pass by. But, think about this - Doing what he's done has gotten 65,000 people to put down deposits on a vehicle. He's got a factory, a design, several prototypes, and legislation done. He's done all this without selling out. He's done this on HIS schedule, not ours. It's easy to sit back and say "I would have gotten someone rich to bankroll this thing." Yeah, and then that someone rich gets all the profits... What does it really matter to Paul if this endeavor takes another year or two? Really, what does it matter? Let's pretend he's delayed long enough to piss off every single reservationist. Would that stop Elios from being built? Would a new investor care about some past investors? Maybe not. Perhaps Paul is a real genius in his business practices. How could we possibly know any different at this point?

Well said Ty. He sure did good with everything he's accomplished up to this point. And the 65K are proof of their support and "belief" that PE and his team can pull it off and deliver a ridiculously low priced 3wheeler for the masses. Most of them goes all in knowing the risk of getting nothing in return but just to support the project. And then there are some just blinded by the appeal of such a price without realizing said risk exist and started getting "pissed off" when projected delivery schedules didn't go as projected. Honestly, when I first saw the picture of the ELIO, I sent my $100 "want in" faster than I can type my credit card number and said to myself, "why not"!. I didn't care reading all that fine print deal, it's worth the risk for that measly deposit. But time has changed, perception about EM has changed, because as the hype was building up, so are the reservationists upping their ante to "all in" for their place in line and of course, he we are, with funding still the big issue going for years now. So people believe what they want to believe, but I won't blame those that lost their faith and chose not to believe....anymore. Just my two cents worth.

 

[RUCRAYZE]

I'm glad to see some mellowing out as this thread continues. Too many confuse trolling with a perspective that challanges the "believers"
I personally enjoy the banter, but cringe when "troll" starts being tossed in as a negative reaction to this project.
I also think India, who have been making 2 and3 wheelers for decades, might jump in at some point. Whoever, the void will be filled and a three wheel autocycle will be on the roads, with or without a 20% import tax.
BTW, I'm in for three units, and hold stock, and have about 2 years to make a decision. My executer, can figure out how to divide it among my kids!
I know I'm in trouble when I told my kid the bathroom light has been going on automatically- then they told me I've been peeing in the frig!

 

[Rob Croson]

Then Mr Blue who bought everything in #3 takes two weeks and uses a few engineers and a project manager to figure out where to go with what they bought. I could see this happening if I was Mr. Blue:
1. Forget the IAV engine and whatever transmissions were chosen.
2. Find a suitable off the shelf new up to date drivetrain that meets 50 state emissions (this is a good selling point because it's easy to do).
3. Forget the airbags because of the liability. Unless there's a federal spec for autocycles and airbags, then avoid that because of liability.
4. As for safety, make it according to any federal laws that apply (again liability).
5. Limited options to make initial assembly and line management lest costly.
6. Conform to the testing procedures that the motorcycle and other similar industries use (i.e. ATV's, trikes, etc).
7. Work out a deal with an existing motorcycle/motorsports manufacturer to distribute, sell and service the vehicle.
8. Build a new plant small that's not like that GM one which is old and bloated. If it wasn't, GM wouldn't have given it up. Locate it in SC, GA, TN or AL. They are really manufacturer friendly.

Your plan is a recipe for failure. Go do some research (there are plenty of threads on this forum that will explain it all), and then realize how much of what you're saying is total bunk.

 

[Samalross]

Your plan is a recipe for failure. Go do some research (there are plenty of threads on this forum that will explain it all), and then realize how much of what you're saying is total bunk.

This is conjecture on your part. There is no one on this forum that would know if his plan would work or not. We all think that we know what's best for Elio production.

 

[eliomemaw]

If I could get a "guarantee" that my ELIO would be delivered on an exact date, I would gladly send in the full amount due.
That would give me a motivation to live longer.

I'm in...I would send my check right now .....they can't use it till 200 mil. is met and they start production.....